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Post by moviebuffbrad on Dec 31, 2017 9:26:08 GMT
But -- these would be almost unquestionable strengths of the ST if they had sat down for like literally five minutes in 2012 and written even the vaguest of plans amid the swastikas and phone numbers on the wall of a bathroom stall in Santa Monica. They're making it up as they go along (by their own admission) and this negates greatly their ability to use this dimension as a strength. You know? I completely agree that it's inherently more interesting to follow protagnists whose ending isn't clear to you from the outset, but if anything these movies have undermined that asset by Doing Whatever with each installment. Innit? Well, the OT was also pretty much made up as it went along. Darth Vader was not going to be Luke's father. Leia was not going to be Luke's sister. Han was going to be an amphibian creature and only became Leia's love interest after his popularity in ANH. Etc. Even the prequels feel made up as they go along, despite being prequels. Nearly everything we learn about the past in the OT is contradicted in the PT, in addition to the latter introducing story elements you'd think would have been mentioned in the former. Either way, I don't think there's really a problem with filmmakers letting their stories and characters evolve naturally. The series would be far less interesting if Vader was just a daddy-killer to be defeated and Luke ended up with Leia despite their lack of chemistry.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 2, 2018 20:59:30 GMT
So far, what do you think is the superior trilogy? Which one do you think better "represents" and respects Star Wars, its lore and the Original Trilogy? Those are two separate questions though:
SO FAR the superior trilogy is the sequel trilogy. Far better filmmaking has gone into the Disney movies than what Lucas did in the PT. Far better directing, far better FX, far better acting, far better editing. I'm sorry, but its not comparable. Lucas lost his touch by the time he came back to SW.
BUT as far as "representing" the lore better one could argue that the PT did that better because it was created by Lucas himself and whatever he says IS lore. No argument.
However I would argue that there were some problems there too IMO. Things like: Midi-chlorians effing up the force? C3PO was created by Anakin/Vader? The Jedi were just a bunch of arrogant jerks who all dressed like Obi Wan did when he lived on Tatooine? I don't think those "represent" the lore so well.
The sequel trilogy is not going to "represent" the lore as well because it shouldn't. What it should be doing is charting new courses. That's what sequels are supposed to do. The reason why we're having a problem with what happened in TLJ is that it charted a new course at the expense of SW lore. And that's kinda messed up.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Jan 3, 2018 0:27:06 GMT
So far, what do you think is the superior trilogy? Which one do you think better "represents" and respects Star Wars, its lore and the Original Trilogy? Those are two separate questions though:
SO FAR the superior trilogy is the sequel trilogy. Far better filmmaking has gone into the Disney movies than what Lucas did in the PT. Far better directing, far better FX, far better acting, far better editing. I'm sorry, but its not comparable. Lucas lost his touch by the time he came back to SW.
BUT as far as "representing" the lore better one could argue that the PT did that better because it was created by Lucas himself and whatever he says IS lore. No argument.
However I would argue that there were some problems there too IMO. Things like: Midi-chlorians effing up the force? C3PO was created by Anakin/Vader? The Jedi were just a bunch of arrogant jerks who all dressed like Obi Wan did when he lived on Tatooine? I don't think those "represent" the lore so well.
The sequel trilogy is not going to "represent" the lore as well because it shouldn't. What it should be doing is charting new courses. That's what sequels are supposed to do. The reason why we're having a problem with what happened in TLJ is that it charted a new course at the expense of SW lore. And that's kinda messed up.
Will you say more about that? Sub-question: what would you have done differently?
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 3, 2018 17:37:48 GMT
Those are two separate questions though:
SO FAR the superior trilogy is the sequel trilogy. Far better filmmaking has gone into the Disney movies than what Lucas did in the PT. Far better directing, far better FX, far better acting, far better editing. I'm sorry, but its not comparable. Lucas lost his touch by the time he came back to SW.
BUT as far as "representing" the lore better one could argue that the PT did that better because it was created by Lucas himself and whatever he says IS lore. No argument.
However I would argue that there were some problems there too IMO. Things like: Midi-chlorians effing up the force? C3PO was created by Anakin/Vader? The Jedi were just a bunch of arrogant jerks who all dressed like Obi Wan did when he lived on Tatooine? I don't think those "represent" the lore so well.
The sequel trilogy is not going to "represent" the lore as well because it shouldn't. What it should be doing is charting new courses. That's what sequels are supposed to do. The reason why we're having a problem with what happened in TLJ is that it charted a new course at the expense of SW lore. And that's kinda messed up.
Will you say more about that? Sub-question: what would you have done differently? For TLJ: imdb2.freeforums.net/thread/78602/hoping-theories
For Sequel Trilogy: I would have started just days before Luke's new academy gets destroyed and move on from there. Except, instead of that event turning Luke into a hermit, I would have had him seeking out more Jedi knowledge, so he could become more powerful, so he could defeat Snoke and save Kylo from the dark side. Everything else the same including all the new characters.
For Prequel Trilogy: I would ERASE TPM. AOTC would have been my Episode 1. A movie set firmly in the middle of the Clone Wars would have been my Episode 2. and Episode 3 would still have been ROTS. Other than that the only major difference I would have made would be to have Anakin turn into Darth Vader sooner so we could actually see him as Vader kicking some Jedi ass instead of just one scene with him going "NOOOOOOO!" (a movie I still hope happens one day - Darth Vader: A Star Wars Story!).
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 21:41:59 GMT
The PT and it isn't even close.
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Post by taylorfirst1 on Jan 10, 2018 21:58:40 GMT
Now everybody loves the PT after I've listened to people bash it for the last 19 years. I like them both and they both go well with the OT.
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Post by politicidal on Jan 10, 2018 22:45:03 GMT
Sequels. The prequels excel at world building but I get more enjoyment from the sequel trilogy.
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Post by simplemoviecommenter on Jan 11, 2018 0:45:05 GMT
I still don't like many things about the PT, but I have to pick that by default, because the ST is hell-bent on cruelly deconstructing and subverting the classic ideas and themes of Star Wars. It does not represent or respect Star Wars or the OT. It tears down the hard-won achievements of the OT characters and given them no inspiring legacies to leave behind. No New Jedi Order brought back from the brink and reformed by savior Luke. No strong Republic that learned from its mistakes. A failed marriage and a offspring that is enemy of the galaxy. A failure of a Jedi and hero. The sequels are just nihilistic. Blaming the Jedi for the Empire and the Jedi should end. If I wanted something that grimdark and deconstructive, I'd leave that to a videogame like KOTOR 2, or books like Legacy of the Force. I would never want any of that to become film canon, even if I'm not against the depressing concepts.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2018 3:17:56 GMT
Now everybody loves the PT after I've listened to people bash it for the last 19 years. I like them both and they both go well with the OT. Tom Keifer understands this. Why don't you?
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