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Post by Lord Death Man on Jan 11, 2018 15:58:23 GMT
Not unlike the Zapruder film, you may have to slow down the footage to understand everything being presented in 2012's seminal superhero classic - The Avengers. When played at one-quarter speed you can more easily see that the Chitauri outnumber the Avengers several hundred to one. But it didn't matter if there were several hundred Chitauri or several hundred thousand Chitauri. The Avengers didn't have to defeat the several hundred Chitauri. All the Avengers had to do was destroy the Chitauri mother ship and then that would've defeat all several hundred Chitauri.
There was only 1 Chitauri mother ship so it shouldn't have taken that long to destroy it? Were the Avengers charging by the hour? Is that why they took their sweet time instead of destroying the Chitauri mother ship immediately? Didn't Tony Stark (who's supposedly a genius) see how the alien mother ship was destroyed in Independence Day and figure out that the Avengers should do the same thing to stop the Chitauri invasion?
Now you're just being childish. If you want people to spend the time it takes to seriously answer your questions you should try being more respectful. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 11, 2018 21:06:27 GMT
No, he was weak. That they couldn't beat him without Superman means the Justice League was weak. That just means the Atlanteans and Amazons and the old Olympian Gods weren't strong either. That's terrible logic. Steppenwolf didn't show any great power the whole film, he needed Parademons to back him up. And even int he climax the big threat isn't from him but from the Motherboxes. Yet somehow, WW (who lasted against DD and Ares) couldn't beat him on her own. Power levels were way out of whack the whole movie. |
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Post by scabab on Jan 11, 2018 21:14:53 GMT
Steppenwolf didn't show any great power the whole film, he needed Parademons to back him up. And even int he climax the big threat isn't from him but from the Motherboxes. Yet somehow, WW (who lasted against DD and Ares) couldn't beat him on her own. Power levels were way out of whack the whole movie. Right so the reverse would be true. We know how strong Wonder Woman is, we know how strong Doomsday and Ares are, we saw how Wonder Woman faired in comparison to those characters so you then apply that comparison to Steppenwolf to see that he is very strong. He is stronger than is stronger than the Gods, stronger than Ares, stronger than Wonder Woman but weaker than Superman. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 11, 2018 22:45:28 GMT
Steppenwolf didn't show any great power the whole film, he needed Parademons to back him up. And even int he climax the big threat isn't from him but from the Motherboxes. Yet somehow, WW (who lasted against DD and Ares) couldn't beat him on her own. Power levels were way out of whack the whole movie. Right so the reverse would be true. We know how strong Wonder Woman is, we know how strong Doomsday and Ares are, we saw how Wonder Woman faired in comparison to those characters so you then apply that comparison to Steppenwolf to see that he is very strong. He is stronger than is stronger than the Gods, stronger than Ares, stronger than Wonder Woman but weaker than Superman. Problem is, Steppenwolf didn't show any power on par with Doomsday or Ares. You can't just say "he's stronger than them because WW couldn't beat him" and not have him show any real power. WW was able to last against Doomsday, who was stronger than Superman. Superman was clearly stronger than Steppenwolf meaning he's weaker than Doomsday...but WW couldn't last against him? |
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Post by Skaathar on Jan 11, 2018 23:10:42 GMT
Right so the reverse would be true. We know how strong Wonder Woman is, we know how strong Doomsday and Ares are, we saw how Wonder Woman faired in comparison to those characters so you then apply that comparison to Steppenwolf to see that he is very strong. He is stronger than is stronger than the Gods, stronger than Ares, stronger than Wonder Woman but weaker than Superman. Problem is, Steppenwolf didn't show any power on par with Doomsday or Ares. You can't just say "he's stronger than them because WW couldn't beat him" and not have him show any real power. WW was able to last against Doomsday, who was stronger than Superman. Superman was clearly stronger than Steppenwolf meaning he's weaker than Doomsday...but WW couldn't last against him? Also, DD was fast enough to not have trouble hitting Superman but WW had some success in dodging and blocking hits from DD. Yet Steppenwolf was completely helpless with Superman's speed even though he had no issues trading blows with WW. I said it before and I'll say it again: DC is horrible when it comes to power consistency. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 12, 2018 0:39:57 GMT
It took so long because they didn't know blowing up the mother ship would defeat all the Chitauri troops, also the Chitauri outnumbered them 100's even 1000's to 1 Like I said above, it doesn't matter if the Chitauri outnumbered the Avengers 1000 to 1 or 100,000 to 1. All the Avengers had to do was destroy the Chitauri mother ship to defeat all 1000 Chitauri. And there was only 1 Chitauri mother ship so it shouldn't have taken that long to destroy it. to top it all of they weren't just fighting the Chitauri but protecting people and trying to shut down the portal The portal wouldn't have mattered and they would've saved a lot more people if they had just destroyed the Chitauri mother ship in the 1st 5 minutes. It's similar to when some MCU fan brought up why Steve Trevor didn't take Diana to every trench in Europe so Diana could defeat the German soldiers in every trench in Europe. The reason is because Steve felt that would take too long and they could save more lives by finding and destroying the poison gas and ending the war rather than going to each trench in Europe 1 at a time. Isn't Tony Stark supposed to be a master tactician? How is it that it took him so long to figure out that it would be a lot more efficient and save a lot more lives if the Avengers just took out the Chitauri mother ship instead of fighting the foot soldiers? You said that the Avengers didn't know that blowing up the Chitauri mother shop would defeat all the Chitauri troops. Didn't they see Independence Day? But we don't even have to use Independence Day as an example. In Season 1 Episode 2 of Buck Rogers in the 25th Century, Buck and another officer (Major Duke Danton) in the Earth Defense Directorate were trying to stop a squadron of fighters from invading Earth. They were outnumbered, but Buck knew that the squadron leader was a former officer of the Earth Defense Directorate who had turned mercenary-for-hire and was leading the invasion. Buck pointed out to Duke that if they take out the squadron leader, the rest of the forces would run with their tail between their legs. It's the old "Cut off the head of the snake" strategy that's as old as the days of Julius Caesar. Even if destroying the Chitauri mother ship didn't result in all of the Chitauri suddenly going to sleep, it still would've left the Chitauri without a command ship and would've resulted in the Chitauri being less organized and thus making it easier to defeat them. Yet it never occurred to Tony Stark, supposedly a master tactician, to try to cut off the head of the snake first and see what the result of that would be? |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 12, 2018 0:44:13 GMT
And the worst part is you deleted my original post and you only responding to about 15% of it and leaving the rest out of it which is making me look some kind of asshole with no argument I always do that. So the thread doesn't become nothing but two people's off topic argument I'll delete all but the latest responses. I don't have time to reply to the entirety of everyone's posts. Also whilst anyone can choose to ignore him specifically; he still can derail threads with his nuttiness which is half the issue, seeing how you have no issue publicly chastising others for their behaviour being disruptive and off topic you should do the same for DC-Fan, same for him making multiple threads on the same topics that have already caused mass outrage by people, he knows and so do you how his "Feige & the MCU hate Us soldier" bullshit really annoys some people on here and every time he restarts those threads it adds nothing new other than more anger so why allow him to make them over and over without just telling him ok enough is enough leave this topic the fuck alone? I assume you want this board and the DC one to run smooth but ignoring DC-Fan and telling everyone else to behave better rather than him the instigator of the problems only makes things worse, I find him enjoyable in a odd sort of way as I find yelling into the void cathartic, so I'm not endorsing a ban on him but actually police him like you do others, stop making it appear like you are biased by actually trying to control his trolling, honestly if you deleted or edited his more insane pointless except to bait people post's maybe people would settle down a bit, DC-Fan isn't the only cause to peoples anger at him at the moment you are also with all due respect, instead of ignoring this maybe you could try rectifying it? I try and help threads stay on topic when possible and I have done the same with DC Fan but I'm not on here constantly. I'm not always there at the exact moment when a post causes a thread to go off topic or I just might not see it at all. When that happens I've got to be tagged and told about it without the constant push to ban people. Just simply letting me know is all that needs to be done. Also realise that you only see what there is to see. For all the problems and arguments that you lot see and become a part of, there's more that never happened to begin with because I nipped it in the bud before it began. You also expect too much out my modding. All I wanted to do was make the board somewhat better than it currently was at the time. For people to cut down on insults, nonsense OT threads and people provoking each other by posting DC topics on the Marvel board and vice versa. Well that has happened. Over time people have wanted more and more out of me. It's gone from people not wanting me to edit posts to wanting me to have people banned. I shouldn't have to tell you people how to behave in the first place, most of you are adults and you should know not to bait people or be purposefully baited. You've been fair to all sides and have done a great job. People here don't seem to appreciate how much time it takes to do the job, especially after CarrotTop quit and abandoned you to do the job all by yourself. |
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Post by Skaathar on Jan 12, 2018 0:48:52 GMT
Meh. In the end, people loved Avengers way more than Justice League. So you can complain about chitauri all you want, they accomplished their purpose.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 12, 2018 0:50:26 GMT
It took so long because they didn't know blowing up the mother ship would defeat all the Chitauri troops, also the Chitauri outnumbered them 100's even 1000's to 1 Like I said above, it doesn't matter if the Chitauri outnumbered the Avengers 1000 to 1 or 100,000 to 1. All the Avengers had to do was destroy the Chitauri mother ship to defeat all 1000 Chitauri. And there was only 1 Chitauri mother ship so it shouldn't have taken that long to destroy it. to top it all of they weren't just fighting the Chitauri but protecting people and trying to shut down the portal The portal wouldn't have mattered and they would've saved a lot more people if they had just destroyed the Chitauri mother ship in the 1st 5 minutes. It's similar to when some MCU fan brought up why Steve Trevor didn't take Diana to every trench in Europe so Diana could defeat the German soldiers in every trench in Europe. The reason is because Steve felt that would take too long and they could save more lives by finding and destroying the poison gas and ending the war rather than going to each trench in Europe 1 at a time. Isn't Tony Stark supposed to be a master tactician? How is it that it took him so long to figure out that it would be a lot more efficient and save a lot more lives if the Avengers just took out the Chitauri mother ship instead of fighting the foot soldiers? You said that the Avengers didn't know that blowing up the Chitauri mother shop would defeat all the Chitauri troops. Didn't they see Independence Day? But we don't even have to use Independence Day as an example. In Season 1 Episode 2 of Buck Rogers in the 25th Century, Buck and another officer (Major Duke Danton) in the Earth Defense Directorate were trying to stop a squadron of fighters from invading Earth. They were outnumbered, but Buck knew that the squadron leader was a former officer of the Earth Defense Directorate who had turned mercenary-for-hire and was leading the invasion. Buck pointed out to Duke that if they take out the squadron leader, the rest of the forces would run with their tail between their legs. It's the old "Cut off the head of the snake" strategy that's as old as the days of Julius Caesar. Even if destroying the Chitauri mother ship didn't result in all of the Chitauri suddenly going to sleep, it still would've left the Chitauri without a command ship and would've resulted in the Chitauri being less organized and thus making it easier to defeat them. Yet it never occurred to Tony Stark, supposedly a master tactician, to try to cut off the head of the snake first and see what the result of that would be? They didn't know blowing up the mothership would stop the Chitauri. If you watched the movie you'd know this. Really watch it, instead of stealing. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 12, 2018 0:56:55 GMT
I admit you've got more restraint than me though, if I had to put up with Raptor demanding bans so much id end up banning anyone guilty of calling for one without cause, also I noticed after I posted last time you had already done what I said in deleting the lunatics less than useful posts in the Stan Lee thread, showing you do infact police even DC-Fan and I had jumped to a false conclusion, so I do apologise for that scabab has been fair to all sides and is doing a good job. The problem isn't with me or scabab. The problem is that too many MCU fans here think that MCU is so perfect that they can't accept any criticism of MCU. I've said before that the DC in my username stands for Dallas Cowboys. The Cowboys are the most popular pro sports team in America. The Cowboys are also the most hated pro sports team in America. I often post on the Sports board here on IMDb2 and there are often many posts criticizing the Cowboys. But I don't throw a hissy fit or go calling the mods or Admins to ban people simply for criticizing the Cowboys. Yet many MCU fans here throw a hissy fit and go calling for bans simply because someone writes a post that's critical of MCU. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 12, 2018 0:58:40 GMT
Like I said above, it doesn't matter if the Chitauri outnumbered the Avengers 1000 to 1 or 100,000 to 1. All the Avengers had to do was destroy the Chitauri mother ship to defeat all 1000 Chitauri. And there was only 1 Chitauri mother ship so it shouldn't have taken that long to destroy it. The portal wouldn't have mattered and they would've saved a lot more people if they had just destroyed the Chitauri mother ship in the 1st 5 minutes. It's similar to when some MCU fan brought up why Steve Trevor didn't take Diana to every trench in Europe so Diana could defeat the German soldiers in every trench in Europe. The reason is because Steve felt that would take too long and they could save more lives by finding and destroying the poison gas and ending the war rather than going to each trench in Europe 1 at a time. Isn't Tony Stark supposed to be a master tactician? How is it that it took him so long to figure out that it would be a lot more efficient and save a lot more lives if the Avengers just took out the Chitauri mother ship instead of fighting the foot soldiers? You said that the Avengers didn't know that blowing up the Chitauri mother shop would defeat all the Chitauri troops. Didn't they see Independence Day? But we don't even have to use Independence Day as an example. In Season 1 Episode 2 of Buck Rogers in the 25th Century, Buck and another officer (Major Duke Danton) in the Earth Defense Directorate were trying to stop a squadron of fighters from invading Earth. They were outnumbered, but Buck knew that the squadron leader was a former officer of the Earth Defense Directorate who had turned mercenary-for-hire and was leading the invasion. Buck pointed out to Duke that if they take out the squadron leader, the rest of the forces would run with their tail between their legs. It's the old "Cut off the head of the snake" strategy that's as old as the days of Julius Caesar. Even if destroying the Chitauri mother ship didn't result in all of the Chitauri suddenly going to sleep, it still would've left the Chitauri without a command ship and would've resulted in the Chitauri being less organized and thus making it easier to defeat them. Yet it never occurred to Tony Stark, supposedly a master tactician, to try to cut off the head of the snake first and see what the result of that would be? They didn't know blowing up the mothership would stop the Chitauri. So you're saying that it never occurred to Tony Stark, who's supposedly a master tactician, to try blowing up the command ship first and see if that would give them advantage?
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 12, 2018 1:27:45 GMT
They didn't know blowing up the mothership would stop the Chitauri. So you're saying that it never occurred to Tony Stark, who's supposedly a master tactician, to try blowing up the command ship first and see if that would give them advantage?
Why would it? They didn't even know there was a mothership up there to begin with, they just knew there was something bad on the other side of that portal and they got lucky that a nuke was strong enough to stun the Chitauri long enough to stop the portal. This is the MCU, they don't give their heroes easy outs the way DCEU does. |
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Jan 12, 2018 1:40:11 GMT
In all fairness the whole nuke thing was a big gamble, but keep in mind that the nuke wasn't intended for the mother ship. The nuke was originally intended for New York City as a last desperation attempt to stop an alien invasion.
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Post by seahawksraawk00 on Jan 12, 2018 2:06:12 GMT
They didn't know blowing up the mothership would stop the Chitauri. So you're saying that it never occurred to Tony Stark, who's supposedly a master tactician, to try blowing up the command ship first and see if that would give them advantage?
The mothership wasn't even over the city, it was still in the portal, which they were trying to close while also trying to save people. Tony was just trying to get rid of the nuke. It's not like he thought, 'oh, let's just blow up the mothership'. He flew it into the portal just to get rid of the nuke. Blowing up the mothership was purely coincidental. It never occurred to Batman or Superman to give the spear to Wonder Woman for her to kill Doomsday so Superman wouldn't get a totally unearned death? Or the entire time in BvS, Batman never realized that Lex Luthor was playing him against Superman? Or if Batman was really smart, he'd realize the whole time that Superman was never the enemy? Or that he had a mother? Lex Luthor knew somehow, and Batman the world's greatest detective but never knew. If you really wanna pull that shit and ask why Tony never considered blowing up the mothership, then you have to ask these questions too. |
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Post by Skaathar on Jan 12, 2018 2:31:39 GMT
Yeah, kinda hard to decide to blow up the mothership when you didn't know it was there in the first place.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 12, 2018 4:57:17 GMT
Yeah, kinda hard to decide to blow up the mothership when you didn't know it was there in the first place. So an alien army was invading and you're saying that it never occurred to Tony Stark or any of the other Avengers that the army must have a commander who's calling the shots and taking out that commander could give them the advantage? Like I said before, that "Cut off the head of the snake" strategy has been a basic battle strategy since the days of Julius Caesar. |
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Post by Nicko's Nose on Jan 12, 2018 5:01:04 GMT
Such a child...
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Post by Skaathar on Jan 12, 2018 5:52:30 GMT
Yeah, kinda hard to decide to blow up the mothership when you didn't know it was there in the first place. So an alien army was invading and you're saying that it never occurred to Tony Stark or any of the other Avengers that the army must have a commander who's calling the shots and taking out that commander could give them the advantage? Like I said before, that "Cut off the head of the snake" strategy has been a basic battle strategy since the days of Julius Caesar. Yes, because as far as most people were concerned Loki was the one calling the shots. Nobody knew there was a mothership nor that killing the mothership would kill the rest. |
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Post by scabab on Jan 12, 2018 10:50:06 GMT
It's true, the Nuke was meant to just destroy New York. Iron Man happened to get a hold of it and put it through the portal where by chance there was the Mothership which conveniently shut all the Chitari down when destroyed. It's not like they knew there was one up there or that it would shut down all the others. They were also very preoccupied. Problem is, Steppenwolf didn't show any power on par with Doomsday or Ares. You can't just say "he's stronger than them because WW couldn't beat him" and not have him show any real power. WW was able to last against Doomsday, who was stronger than Superman. Superman was clearly stronger than Steppenwolf meaning he's weaker than Doomsday...but WW couldn't last against him? Well Steppenwolf clearly wasn't as strong as Doomsday because the former was easily beaten by Superman and the latter was giving Superman trouble. He was clearly shown to be more powerful than Ares. Ares defeated all the Gods but was defeated by Zeus and his lightning. He was later killed when Wonder Woman deflected Zeus's lightning through Ares. Meanwhile Steppenwolf was hit by this same lightning and wasnt really affected by it that much. That Ares was beaten by the just Zeus alone whereas they all needed to show up along with the Amazons, Atlantans and a Green Lantern to fight Steppenwolf shows there was a big difference. That Wonder Woman beat Ares but was at best able to hold her own against Steppenwolf shows how powerful he is in comparison. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 12, 2018 11:53:48 GMT
Well Steppenwolf clearly wasn't as strong as Doomsday because the former was easily beaten by Superman and the latter was giving Superman trouble. Exactly. If Steppenwolf was weaker than Doomsday than WW should've been able to fight him better. We still don't know HOW Ares killed all the other Gods, given how much stronger Zeus was implied to be than him. No, it just means we're told he's strong but nothing shows it on the screen. That it took those combined forces to stop him just makes the Amazons and Atlanteans look weak. |
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