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Post by summers8 on Jan 19, 2018 7:06:24 GMT
Found this on another forum. its a great post to discuss here.
This is the potential face offs of the 2020s at some point from Marvel and DC movies Though I think the superhero genre is on the way out. I truly believe Steven Spielberg when he compared it to westerns. at the same time we are moving to a new phrase that could be a way to limit the saturation of these movies. MCU has X-Men, DC has kind of a Christopher Nolan successor back in Matt Reeves as Zack Snyder hangs in the towels.
There is a good chance the first MCU X-Men movie will come out around the same time as the new Batman Movies written and directed by Matt Reeves. What are the chances of the MCU X-MEN been better? the chances look very slim. Will fun, gags spectacles, big budget, little substance MCU X-Men be a true match for the more serious, human direct approach and theme based Batman movies if they are released the same year? or are we going to have another Iron Man and The Dark Knight moment in 2008. And the aftermath and the consequences, Will MCU X-Men survive when they are put to the question of how the DC new Batman films was what an X-Men movie should have been like and not what MCU made, something likely similar to Guardians of the Galaxy than X-Men? how much of a threat and a art house challenge will MCU X-Men be after they follow the overused gaged up marvel formula to a inimitable craftsman work of Batman with Matt Reeves calling the shots. it's Batman after all.
Am a big fan of X-Men and I am already getting the right instincts that I will end up loving the the new Batman movies over the MCU X-Men movies since I already love the planet of the apes trilogy more than all the MCU movies.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 19, 2018 8:07:24 GMT
Found this another forum. its a great post to discuss here. This is the potential face offs of the 2020s at some point from Marvel and DC movies Though I think the superhero genre is on the way out. I truly believe Steven Spielberg when he compared it to westerns. at the same time we are moving to a new phrase that could be a way to limit the saturation of these movies. MCU has X-Men, DC has kind of a Christopher Nolan successor back in Matt Reeves as Zack Snyder hangs in the towels. There is a good chance the first MCU X-Men movie will come out around the same time as the new Batman Movies written and directed by Matt Reeves. What are the chances of the MCU X-MEN been better? the chances look very slim. Will fun, gags spectacles, big budget, little substance MCU X-Men be a true match for the more serious, human direct approach and theme based Batman movies if they are released the same year? or are we going to have another Iron Man and The Dark Knight moment in 2008. And the aftermath and the consequences, Will MCU X-Men survive when they are put to the question of how the DC new Batman films was what an X-Men movie should have been like and not what MCU made, something likely similar to Guardians of the Galaxy than X-Men? how much of a threat and a art house challenge will MCU X-Men be after they follow the overused gaged up marvel formula to a inimitable craftsman work of Batman with Matt Reeves calling the shots. it's Batman after all. Am a big fan of X-Men and I am already getting the right instincts that I will end up loving the the new Batman movies over the MCU X-Men movies since I already love the planet of the apes trilogy more than all the MCU movies. The answer is Yes, the new Batman movies will be much better than MCU X-Men. Because MCU is going to fuck up the X-Men and turn it into a joke-fest. And that doesn't work for the X-Men. Discrimination and persecution are major themes of the X-Men and those are themes that shouldn't be turned into jokes, but MCU is going to treat those as jokes just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes. |
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Jan 19, 2018 9:47:50 GMT
Let's put it like this. When I first saw Logan buried and the cross becoming an X I thought: What a daring, great and touching movie, an end of an eara. Is that an indication of future grown up blockbuster CMBs? But when I recently rewatched Logan after the Disney acquisition of Fox I literally saw that it was prophetic, and I felt genuine sorrow and pain: It was really a glorious sundown that was mistaken for a new dawn.
The X Men are really dead - long live the X-Men.  I am not looking forward to MCU-Wolverine uttering things like: You should not have killed my mommy...or messed up my perfect claw pedicure.
If the next Batman is not better than that, just bury him next to Logan! X marks the spot for mature, intelligent CBMs... |
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Post by charzhino on Jan 19, 2018 11:17:15 GMT
Neither film studios version of Batman or Xmen will be good. Theres only 1 direction where all CBMs are going because audiences dictate film quality. Its quite clear "the people" (kids and families) want lighthearted, safe, jokey films with little stakes in the mould of Guardians of the galaxy. They make the most money which is why Disney made Ragnarok into a straight up comedy downgrading it from The Dark World and also why Justice League (and suicide Squad) had the same campy lame humour from the MCU and was so diffrent to BvS and MoS, both better movies. Throw in Last Jedi to that mix too. All cheesefests.
Fact is no superhero films after 2020 will be give the substance with artistic style that Nolan provided with his Batman movies, Raimis first 2 Spidermans and all Xmen films. They will be soulless and will be serialized to death.
MCU will not make Claremont/Byrne era Xmen better than Fox has, no matter how colourful the costumes are. The fact theyre immediately and forcibly wanting Xmen to crossovr into the MCU and have some Xmen vs Avengers crap is evident enough they dont care about xmens history.
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Post by sostie on Jan 19, 2018 11:52:02 GMT
There's no way of knowing or judging...I guess only by recent track records. In which case I expect the X-Men films to be better
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Post by summers8 on Jan 19, 2018 14:44:17 GMT
Found this another forum. its a great post to discuss here. This is the potential face offs of the 2020s at some point from Marvel and DC movies Though I think the superhero genre is on the way out. I truly believe Steven Spielberg when he compared it to westerns. at the same time we are moving to a new phrase that could be a way to limit the saturation of these movies. MCU has X-Men, DC has kind of a Christopher Nolan successor back in Matt Reeves as Zack Snyder hangs in the towels. There is a good chance the first MCU X-Men movie will come out around the same time as the new Batman Movies written and directed by Matt Reeves. What are the chances of the MCU X-MEN been better? the chances look very slim. Will fun, gags spectacles, big budget, little substance MCU X-Men be a true match for the more serious, human direct approach and theme based Batman movies if they are released the same year? or are we going to have another Iron Man and The Dark Knight moment in 2008. And the aftermath and the consequences, Will MCU X-Men survive when they are put to the question of how the DC new Batman films was what an X-Men movie should have been like and not what MCU made, something likely similar to Guardians of the Galaxy than X-Men? how much of a threat and a art house challenge will MCU X-Men be after they follow the overused gaged up marvel formula to a inimitable craftsman work of Batman with Matt Reeves calling the shots. it's Batman after all. Am a big fan of X-Men and I am already getting the right instincts that I will end up loving the the new Batman movies over the MCU X-Men movies since I already love the planet of the apes trilogy more than all the MCU movies. The answer is Yes, the new Batman movies will be much better than MCU X-Men. Because MCU is going to fuck up the X-Men and turn it into a joke-fest. And that doesn't work for the X-Men. Discrimination and persecution are major themes of the X-Men and those are themes that shouldn't be turned into jokes, but MCU is going to treat those as jokes just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes. James Mangold ,director of Logan already gave his blessing to the new Batman movies been made by his friend Matt Reeves. Mangold thinks he will do an awesome job. funny, Mangold thinks MCU will mess up X-Men. Its a no brainer which will be the better movie. as a fan of xmen/batman, I will likely also enjoy Reeves Batman (as a xmen movie) more than MCU X-Men. sad |
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Post by scabab on Jan 19, 2018 16:43:23 GMT
Who can say. We have no idea in the slightest what the MCU X-men will be like not do we have much inclination of how the Batman movie would turn out.
All we really know is that he Batman movie has a great director behind it and that's about it.
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jan 19, 2018 17:46:39 GMT
Found this another forum. its a great post to discuss here. This is the potential face offs of the 2020s at some point from Marvel and DC movies Though I think the superhero genre is on the way out. I truly believe Steven Spielberg when he compared it to westerns. at the same time we are moving to a new phrase that could be a way to limit the saturation of these movies. MCU has X-Men, DC has kind of a Christopher Nolan successor back in Matt Reeves as Zack Snyder hangs in the towels. There is a good chance the first MCU X-Men movie will come out around the same time as the new Batman Movies written and directed by Matt Reeves. What are the chances of the MCU X-MEN been better? the chances look very slim. Will fun, gags spectacles, big budget, little substance MCU X-Men be a true match for the more serious, human direct approach and theme based Batman movies if they are released the same year? or are we going to have another Iron Man and The Dark Knight moment in 2008. And the aftermath and the consequences, Will MCU X-Men survive when they are put to the question of how the DC new Batman films was what an X-Men movie should have been like and not what MCU made, something likely similar to Guardians of the Galaxy than X-Men? how much of a threat and a art house challenge will MCU X-Men be after they follow the overused gaged up marvel formula to a inimitable craftsman work of Batman with Matt Reeves calling the shots. it's Batman after all. Am a big fan of X-Men and I am already getting the right instincts that I will end up loving the the new Batman movies over the MCU X-Men movies since I already love the planet of the apes trilogy more than all the MCU movies. The answer is Yes, the new Batman movies will be much better than MCU X-Men. Because MCU is going to fuck up the X-Men and turn it into a joke-fest. And that doesn't work for the X-Men. Discrimination and persecution are major themes of the X-Men and those are themes that shouldn't be turned into jokes, but MCU is going to treat those as jokes just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes. When have they treated war and murder as jokes? Wait, you know what? Nevermind, you're just trying to bait people like the OP is doing. |
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Post by politicidal on Jan 19, 2018 18:03:28 GMT
They both have the chance to fully embrace the comics' out-there elements. Not that either their predecessors were worse for not doing so, but there was something refreshing about Batman fighting monsters and aliens as often as he did humans in BVS and Justice League.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 19, 2018 23:34:51 GMT
Doubtful, Batman really only did as well as he did in cinema because he had no real competition from other studios. The MCU has redefined things to the point that people are realizing that the way Batman and Superman movies are done is no longer the only way and they have alternatives and go to the movies with this mindset.
The MCU will do X-Men right, without having to sell-out for that 'grounded' aesthetic and go for truly creative stuff Fox was too cowardly to do.
As for Mangold, he thinks all CBMs should be rated R with blood, gore and sex to substitute actual plot.
And Reeves...I liked War for the Planet of the Apes but it had its flaws. The Jesus symbolism in particular was godawful.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 19, 2018 23:47:34 GMT
I am not looking forward to MCU-Wolverine uttering things like: You should not have killed my mommy...or messed up my perfect claw pedicureYou didn't have a problem with WW's "Love will save the world" nonsense. Quill and Starks' dialog is naturalistic. Fixed. That era is thankfully dead and gone. We'll get something authentic now. EDIT: And I might as well say it, Logan was only good because it was Jackman and Stewarts' last time in the saddle so both audiences and Critics went easy on them. Otherwise they'd have been more willing to pick away at the predictable, banal plot, lame antagonists, the way all the other X-Men were wasted just for Logans' sake, etc. |
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Post by scabab on Jan 20, 2018 0:25:50 GMT
And I might as well say it, Logan was only good because it was Jackman and Stewarts' last time in the saddle so both audiences and Critics went easy on them. Otherwise they'd have been more willing to pick away at the predictable, banal plot, lame antagonists, the way all the other X-Men were wasted just for Logans' sake, etc. You say that but then you've also said that critics haven't actually said that at all. So you're just assuming that's why they gave it good reviews even though the actual good reviews give numerous other reasons entirely for why they thought it was good. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jan 20, 2018 2:39:18 GMT
The answer is Yes, the new Batman movies will be much better than MCU X-Men. Because MCU is going to fuck up the X-Men and turn it into a joke-fest. And that doesn't work for the X-Men. Discrimination and persecution are major themes of the X-Men and those are themes that shouldn't be turned into jokes, but MCU is going to treat those as jokes just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes. When have they treated war and murder as jokes? Wait, you know what? Nevermind, you're just trying to bait people like the OP is doing. I'm not baiting anyone and neither is the OP. We're just calling it as it is. MCU will turn the X-Men movies into a joke just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes.
Heck, while the Chitauri were killing people, Iron called the battle a party. And no, I'm not making that up. It was in the movie. Iron Man really called the Battle of New York a party. And then there as GotG, where Ronan the Big Bad Destroyer gets defeated by a silly Dance-Off.
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 20, 2018 3:03:52 GMT
And I might as well say it, Logan was only good because it was Jackman and Stewarts' last time in the saddle so both audiences and Critics went easy on them. Otherwise they'd have been more willing to pick away at the predictable, banal plot, lame antagonists, the way all the other X-Men were wasted just for Logans' sake, etc. You say that but then you've also said that critics haven't actually said that at all. They aren't going to admit it. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 20, 2018 3:04:56 GMT
MCU will turn the X-Men movies into a joke just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes. When have they done that? He said he was "bringing the party" to them. Military jargon type stuff you see in movies all the time. |
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Post by scabab on Jan 20, 2018 4:10:10 GMT
They aren't going to admit it. Which means you have no proof of your claim and it's just an assumption. It just comes across as an excuse to explain why the movie was considered better than the competition which you've also done for Wonder Woman and The Dark Knight. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Jan 20, 2018 4:29:45 GMT
They aren't going to admit it. Which means you have no proof of your claim and it's just an assumption. It just comes across as an excuse to explain why the movie was considered better than the competition which you've also done for Wonder Woman and The Dark Knight. Maybe it is, but it's a reasonable assumption. After all, people keep going on an on about what a great deconstruction of Westerns "Unforgiven" was when the true deconstruction of the Western was much earlier in 1969's "The Wild Bunch". It's just that Unforgiven was also Clint Eastwood's last Western so it got more attention. |
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Post by JudgeJuryDredd on Jan 20, 2018 5:24:55 GMT
When have they treated war and murder as jokes? Wait, you know what? Nevermind, you're just trying to bait people like the OP is doing. I'm not baiting anyone and neither is the OP. We're just calling it as it is. MCU will turn the X-Men movies into a joke just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes.
Heck, while the Chitauri were killing people, Iron called the battle a party. And no, I'm not making that up. It was in the movie. Iron Man really called the Battle of New York a party. And then there as GotG, where Ronan the Big Bad Destroyer gets defeated by a silly Dance-Off.
Nope, you and the OP are baiting people and are not challenging anybody's train of thought except for thenewnexus. The actual line was "bringing the party to them", which is a figure of speech everybody makes when they take something huge over to a person or group or dwelling. It can be used in a number of different ways, serious or not. Ronan wasn't defeated by a dance-off, of course you'll say he did to bait people into angrily replying to you - good luck with that, but me and others recognize this juvenile tactic and are bored with it. You know Ronan didn't go down like that, stop the crap already it isn't even annoying anymore its just a tiresome eye roll. |
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Post by thenewnexus on Jan 20, 2018 8:09:56 GMT
Things like that dance off in Guardians are unessasiry. That Baskin Robbins scene in Antman was cringey.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Jan 20, 2018 10:30:27 GMT
I'm not baiting anyone and neither is the OP. We're just calling it as it is. MCU will turn the X-Men movies into a joke just like they treat war and people getting killed as big jokes.
Heck, while the Chitauri were killing people, Iron called the battle a party. And no, I'm not making that up. It was in the movie. Iron Man really called the Battle of New York a party. And then there as GotG, where Ronan the Big Bad Destroyer gets defeated by a silly Dance-Off.
Ronan wasn't defeated by a dance-off, of course you'll say he did to bait people into angrily replying to you - good luck with that, but me and others recognize this juvenile tactic and are bored with it. You know Ronan didn't go down like that, stop the crap already it isn't even annoying anymore its just a tiresome eye roll. with all due respect Judge, you know that this makes it WORSE, right? The main villain of the film was distracted by a dance off and then defeated by a magic stone (!). This is the epitome of lazy writing pandering to a lowbrow, juvenile audience. If it was just the dance-off the scene could have been satirical like say things in The Princess Bride. The way it is it's just horribly written: Ronan: What are you doing? Peter Quill: Dance-off, bro. Me and you. [holds out his hand for Gamora] Ronan: What are you doing? Peter Quill: I'm distracting you, you big turd blossom! Ronan: You're mortal! How... Peter Quill: You said it, bitch. We're the Guardians of the Galaxy. [the Guardians strike Ronan]  |
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