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Post by goz on Oct 25, 2019 20:56:23 GMT
Thanks for taking the time to type all that however I am afraid it doesn't answer any of my questions adequately. I don't want to live with God, especially as I believe he/she/it doesn't exist, I want a body like I have to be able to experience stuff, to think and feel and I don't believe in a soul. My body and I are indivisible and co-dependant. I wouldn't be happy without a body and experiences and family and a real natural world, so I choose endless death when my body fails or I die from some other reason. The really cool thing about this solution is that just as I knew nothing before I was born, I will know nothing about this whole process. we all have a free will to choose; to believe God or not. we will be in a new spiritual body after the resurrection from the dead. read about heaven before you decide you don't want to be there.
God is under no obligation to make things the way you want them to be. He threw out 1/3 rd of the angels who rebelled in heaven with the fallen angels. that won't happen again.
i wouldn't let Anything keep me out of heaven. especially misunderstandings of what is to Be regardless of whether we believe it or not.
i would carefully read Revelation 21 & 22 before going into eternity.
the bible has all the answers you seek
Thanks butt no thanks. The Bible is written by mortal men, it contradictory, mistranslated, misinterpreted and misconstrued. It is so unlikely that God exists as to be negligible therefore I am not going to alter my one life for some fairy story and alleged words mad up by Middle Eastern ancient men, heaven sounds appalling unfamiliar and boring, there is no such thing as a spiritual body (WTF?) and I have better things to do than read the Bible. There are so many wonderful books documentaries and articles out there where I can educate myself on things that affect real people and our beautiful natural world. May I say you are wasting your time and are delusional? You have every right to be, it is just a pity, however I don't like YOU prosthelytising to me, so no more on this issue from me. Just no, thanks, butt an emphatic no thanks.
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Post by goz on Oct 25, 2019 23:16:39 GMT
OK, here are a few hints: I will phrase them as questions for you to answer if you think you know the answers. 1. How old will I be physically in 'heaven'? 2. Will I have my loved ones there? 3. What will I actually do...how will I fill my 'time'? 4. If I die before my children will I have to wait for them? 5. Will all the billions of people already dead be in 'heaven' with me? 6. Will I be reunited with my beloved dogs I have owned? There is nine of them. Cats? 7. Will I still be able to enjoy my hobbies what I love now that make my life worthwhile? my family garden cooking nature walks reading swimming in the ocean etc etc etc … and the big one Will my husband be there and can I have sex in heaven? eat chocolate laugh scratch myself dream reflect on my life...……... One of the things your get to do in Heaven is to not be bothered or even have to remember all your family and friends suffering in Hell. Because to remember them and their eternal, infinite torment and pain will be suffering also. There is no suffering in Heaven. So Christians, take a good look at the people you will forever forget. Now there is a novel approach I had previously not thought of! I wonder what itsmagic has to say about that! What if your mother or sister had abortions? or your brother was a 'homosexual'!
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Post by goz on Oct 25, 2019 23:43:03 GMT
Now there is a novel approach I had previously not thought of! I wonder what itsmagic has to say about that! What if your mother or sister had abortions? or your brother was a 'homosexual'! Once a woman was trying to convince me to convert to the Baptist Church. She was nice, nothing pushy about her, but part of her sell was she wanted everybody to have a chance at Heaven because she hated thinking so many of her loved ones would suffer. So that’s what I told her. That since there is no suffering or pain or even tears in the Heaven she believes in, she will not remember her family once in Paradise. She will have no choice but to be happy. And if she does remember them, she will feel nothing for them. It is a rule that I have now, that I NEVER engage in conversation with prosthelytisers, however before I reformed, one of my greatest delights was to point out the logical fallacies upon which they based their 'blurbs'! I even avoid talking about religion much in real life as it is too problematic. Fortunately most of my acquaintance is atheist of some degree, or non practising, especially ex-Catholics!!
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Post by itsmagic on Oct 26, 2019 2:33:59 GMT
< now who might want to horribilize Heaven > ?
i cannot imagine how an infinitely good Loving heavenly Father will reward His children forever.
we retain ourselves, i believe, in all the positive memories in ourselves transformed into spiritual bodies. the elders in the presence of God in Revelation lay down their crowns and fell down before Him, so there is a form we recognize.
so i believe we will recognize others. EVERYTHING IS LOVE.
imagine everything you EVER dreamed Heaven would be. --- it's better than that ---
look at the universe. He has been building us a New Home for almost 2000 years !!
to drink of the water of life. to eat from the tree of Life eternally in the Heaven of Absolute Perfection.
i know it will be Perfect Love forever.
All You Need IS LOVE
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Post by goz on Oct 26, 2019 3:32:26 GMT
< now who might want to horribilize Heaven > ?
i cannot imagine how an infinitely good Loving heavenly Father will reward His children forever.
we retain ourselves, i believe, in all the positive memories in ourselves transformed into spiritual bodies. the elders in the presence of God in Revelation lay down their crowns and fell down before Him, so there is a form we recognize.
so i believe we will recognize others. EVERYTHING IS LOVE.
imagine everything you EVER dreamed Heaven would be. --- it's better than that ---
look at the universe. He has been building us a New Home for almost 2000 years !!
to drink of the water of life. to eat from the tree of Life eternally in the Heaven of Absolute Perfection.
i know it will be Perfect Love forever.
All You Need IS LOVE
What about the fornicators homosexuals rapists murderers abortionists adulterers?
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Post by itsmagic on Oct 26, 2019 9:25:05 GMT
figuring out Why eternal life should be "problematic" IS the Key Question !!
- this is what keeps you from God -
Please explain to me with rationality, insight and logic what eternal life is? What form does it take, why is it eternal and how is it eternal? * { i shall give you the condensed version for clarity, with the understanding that i can supply chapter and verse for every word. otherwise i should spend hours referencing, typing and retyping for hours additional to annotate. [i'm not a very good typist] these ideas are the gist of the key concepts from numerous places in scripture excerpted for brevity.} *
for ease of understanding eternal life, i recommend reading - in it's entirety - the Gospel of John -
in the new american standard or the new king james version.
[ John 1 : 1 -18 and John 3 : 1 - 17 . other passages will supply additional details for some of it ]
(especially Jn 3: 16 - " For God so loved the world that he gave His Only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. " )
God made man from the dust of the earth. we fell into sin in the garden of eden. we inherited an inclination to sin from our fallen nature. all have sinned and are in need of a Savior. from before the foundation of the world, God made plans for the salvation of man.
to redeem mankind from sin, a perfect Holy God requires a perfect sinless sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus the Son of God. John the baptist said of Him "behold the lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world". Jn 1 :29
John baptized Jesus and the Holy Spirit landed upon Him in the form of a dove. the Father in heaven spoke and said this is my beloved Son, hear Him. after Jesus was tempted in the desert 40 days of the devil, Jesus began His ministry. preaching the fulfillment of prophesies concerning Himself as the Messiah from the time He opened the scroll in the temple to the Book of Isaiah.
when Jesus was born angels sang glory to God. he performed miracles. gave sight to the blind. raised the dead. fed the multitudes. cast out demons. many more astounding miracles than we have record of. so everywhere He went the Gospel was preached and was confirmed by the irrefutable Acts of God.
so a rabbi named Nicodemus came at night to Jesus and said we know that You are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs unless God is with him. Jesus told him " unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." the rabbi didn't understand.
so Jesus told him " unless one is born of the water and the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of heaven. that which is born of the flesh is flesh. that which is born of the spirit is spirit." Jn 3 : 3-6
the eternal God breathed life into the dust. made us in His image. the Holy Spirit created in the virgin Mary a saviour, who is Christ the Lord. now, the Eternal God offers us eternal life through and in His Son. Who died for all the sins of man, and Rose in His Own Body from the dead.
the people from all over would travel to the holy land for the day of pentecost. after Jesus' resurrection, He told them to wait until they received power from on high. the Holy Spirit landed upon the apostles. Peter in Acts 2 told the people they crucified the Son of God.
every man there from all around the world heard the gospel in their own language. ( another miracle ). they were convicted of their sin and said men and brethren what must we do ?
Peter said " repent ( turn away from sin ) and let everyone of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; ( sin is washed away ), and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Acts 2 : 38
"those who gladly received his word were baptized" ( Acts 2 : 41) ; and so the Lord started His Church with 3000 people
on the day of pentecost almost 2000 years ago.
we are buried with Christ in baptism ( like John the baptist with Jesus in the river Jordan ). all of ours sins are washed away by the sacrifice of the sinless Jesus. ( buried with him in baptism, raised to walk in newness of Life with the Holy Spirit within us. a new spiritual life, partakers of the divine nature of the Resurrected Son of God.) Eternal Life begins.
Jesus said " I am the Way, the Truth and the Life ". he who believes in me has passed from death to life.
"I Am the resurrection and the Life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And he who believes in Me shall never die" Jn 11 : 25,26
you might say our journey to our new home in heaven with God has thus begun. a spiritual transformation has taken place when the Holy Spirit resides within our body, spirit and soul. we are the children of God Himself sharing His Divine Nature through the workings of the Father, Jesus the Son of God, and the Holy Spirit.
as God breathed life into the dust to create a man in His Image, so now God has breathed into us the Holy Spirit of Eternal Life. He has preserved for us His Words in the bible. we are born again unto eternal life in the person of Jesus Christ until He returns for those who are His Own - the called -. we are the ones who hear the good shepherds voice.
once before He gave His Life that we might live. and now He freely gives us of His Life eternally.
" I Am the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end, " says the Lord , "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty" Rev 1 : 8
from eternity past, to time without end , He offers us His Eternal Life. now and forever in heaven with God
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Post by goz on Oct 26, 2019 20:30:34 GMT
Please explain to me with rationality, insight and logic what eternal life is? What form does it take, why is it eternal and how is it eternal? * { i shall give you the condensed version for clarity, with the understanding that i can supply chapter and verse for every word. otherwise i should spend hours referencing, typing and retyping for hours additional to annotate. [i'm not a very good typist] these ideas are the gist of the key concepts from numerous places in scripture excerpted for brevity.} *
for ease of understanding eternal life, i recommend reading - in it's entirety - the Gospel of John -
in the new american standard or the new king james version.
[ John 1 : 1 -18 and John 3 : 1 - 17 . other passages will supply additional details for some of it ]
(especially Jn 3: 16 - " For God so loved the world that he gave His Only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. " )
God made man from the dust of the earth. we fell into sin in the garden of eden. we inherited an inclination to sin from our fallen nature. all have sinned and are in need of a Savior. from before the foundation of the world, God made plans for the salvation of man.
to redeem mankind from sin, a perfect Holy God requires a perfect sinless sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus the Son of God. John the baptist said of Him "behold the lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world". Jn 1 :29
John baptized Jesus and the Holy Spirit landed upon Him in the form of a dove. the Father in heaven spoke and said this is my beloved Son, hear Him. after Jesus was tempted in the desert 40 days of the devil, Jesus began His ministry. preaching the fulfillment of prophesies concerning Himself as the Messiah from the time He opened the scroll in the temple to the Book of Isaiah.
when Jesus was born angels sang glory to God. he performed miracles. gave sight to the blind. raised the dead. fed the multitudes. cast out demons. many more astounding miracles than we have record of. so everywhere He went the Gospel was preached and was confirmed by the irrefutable Acts of God.
so a rabbi named Nicodemus came at night to Jesus and said we know that You are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs unless God is with him. Jesus told him " unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." the rabbi didn't understand.
so Jesus told him " unless one is born of the water and the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of heaven. that which is born of the flesh is flesh. that which is born of the spirit is spirit." Jn 3 : 3-6
the eternal God breathed life into the dust. made us in His image. the Holy Spirit created in the virgin Mary a saviour, who is Christ the Lord. now, the Eternal God offers us eternal life through and in His Son. Who died for all the sins of man, and Rose in His Own Body from the dead.
the people from all over would travel to the holy land for the day of pentecost. after Jesus' resurrection, He told them to wait until they received power from on high. the Holy Spirit landed upon the apostles. Peter in Acts 2 told the people they crucified the Son of God.
every man there from all around the world heard the gospel in their own language. ( another miracle ). they were convicted of their sin and said men and brethren what must we do ?
Peter said " repent ( turn away from sin ) and let everyone of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; ( sin is washed away ), and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Acts 2 : 38
"those who gladly received his word were baptized" ( Acts 2 : 41) ; and so the Lord started His Church with 3000 people
on the day of pentecost almost 2000 years ago.
we are buried with Christ in baptism ( like John the baptist with Jesus in the river Jordan ). all of ours sins are washed away by the sacrifice of the sinless Jesus. ( buried with him in baptism, raised to walk in newness of Life with the Holy Spirit within us. a new spiritual life, partakers of the divine nature of the Resurrected Son of God.) Eternal Life begins.
Jesus said " I am the Way, the Truth and the Life ". he who believes in me has passed from death to life.
"I Am the resurrection and the Life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And he who believes in Me shall never die" Jn 11 : 25,26
you might say our journey to our new home in heaven with God has thus begun. a spiritual transformation has taken place when the Holy Spirit resides within our body, spirit and soul. we are the children of God Himself sharing His Divine Nature through the workings of the Father, Jesus the Son of God, and the Holy Spirit.
as God breathed life into the dust to create a man in His Image, so now God has breathed into us the Holy Spirit of Eternal Life. He has preserved for us His Words in the bible. we are born again unto eternal life in the person of Jesus Christ until He returns for those who are His Own - the called -. we are the ones who hear the good shepherds voice.
once before He gave His Life that we might live. and now He freely gives us of His Life eternally.
" I Am the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end, " says the Lord , "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty" Rev 1 : 8
from eternity past, to time without end , He offers us His Eternal Life. now and forever in heaven with God
He didn't ask what the Bible allegedly says it is, he ( and I ) asked what YOU thinks constitutes heaven and what happens in your version of the afterlife.
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Post by itsmagic on Oct 27, 2019 5:08:53 GMT
* { i shall give you the condensed version for clarity, with the understanding that i can supply chapter and verse for every word. otherwise i should spend hours referencing, typing and retyping for hours additional to annotate. [i'm not a very good typist] these ideas are the gist of the key concepts from numerous places in scripture excerpted for brevity.} *
for ease of understanding eternal life, i recommend reading - in it's entirety - the Gospel of John -
in the new american standard or the new king james version.
[ John 1 : 1 -18 and John 3 : 1 - 17 . other passages will supply additional details for some of it ]
(especially Jn 3: 16 - " For God so loved the world that he gave His Only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. " )
God made man from the dust of the earth. we fell into sin in the garden of eden. we inherited an inclination to sin from our fallen nature. all have sinned and are in need of a Savior. from before the foundation of the world, God made plans for the salvation of man.
to redeem mankind from sin, a perfect Holy God requires a perfect sinless sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus the Son of God. John the baptist said of Him "behold the lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world". Jn 1 :29
John baptized Jesus and the Holy Spirit landed upon Him in the form of a dove. the Father in heaven spoke and said this is my beloved Son, hear Him. after Jesus was tempted in the desert 40 days of the devil, Jesus began His ministry. preaching the fulfillment of prophesies concerning Himself as the Messiah from the time He opened the scroll in the temple to the Book of Isaiah.
when Jesus was born angels sang glory to God. he performed miracles. gave sight to the blind. raised the dead. fed the multitudes. cast out demons. many more astounding miracles than we have record of. so everywhere He went the Gospel was preached and was confirmed by the irrefutable Acts of God.
so a rabbi named Nicodemus came at night to Jesus and said we know that You are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs unless God is with him. Jesus told him " unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." the rabbi didn't understand.
so Jesus told him " unless one is born of the water and the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of heaven. that which is born of the flesh is flesh. that which is born of the spirit is spirit." Jn 3 : 3-6
the eternal God breathed life into the dust. made us in His image. the Holy Spirit created in the virgin Mary a saviour, who is Christ the Lord. now, the Eternal God offers us eternal life through and in His Son. Who died for all the sins of man, and Rose in His Own Body from the dead.
the people from all over would travel to the holy land for the day of pentecost. after Jesus' resurrection, He told them to wait until they received power from on high. the Holy Spirit landed upon the apostles. Peter in Acts 2 told the people they crucified the Son of God.
every man there from all around the world heard the gospel in their own language. ( another miracle ). they were convicted of their sin and said men and brethren what must we do ?
Peter said " repent ( turn away from sin ) and let everyone of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; ( sin is washed away ), and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Acts 2 : 38
"those who gladly received his word were baptized" ( Acts 2 : 41) ; and so the Lord started His Church with 3000 people
on the day of pentecost almost 2000 years ago.
we are buried with Christ in baptism ( like John the baptist with Jesus in the river Jordan ). all of ours sins are washed away by the sacrifice of the sinless Jesus. ( buried with him in baptism, raised to walk in newness of Life with the Holy Spirit within us. a new spiritual life, partakers of the divine nature of the Resurrected Son of God.) Eternal Life begins.
Jesus said " I am the Way, the Truth and the Life ". he who believes in me has passed from death to life.
"I Am the resurrection and the Life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And he who believes in Me shall never die" Jn 11 : 25,26
you might say our journey to our new home in heaven with God has thus begun. a spiritual transformation has taken place when the Holy Spirit resides within our body, spirit and soul. we are the children of God Himself sharing His Divine Nature through the workings of the Father, Jesus the Son of God, and the Holy Spirit.
as God breathed life into the dust to create a man in His Image, so now God has breathed into us the Holy Spirit of Eternal Life. He has preserved for us His Words in the bible. we are born again unto eternal life in the person of Jesus Christ until He returns for those who are His Own - the called -. we are the ones who hear the good shepherds voice.
once before He gave His Life that we might live. and now He freely gives us of His Life eternally.
" I Am the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end, " says the Lord , "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty" Rev 1 : 8
from eternity past, to time without end , He offers us His Eternal Life. now and forever in heaven with God
He didn't ask what the Bible allegedly says it is, he ( and I ) asked what YOU thinks constitutes heaven and what happens in your version of the afterlife. didn't want you to think this is my response. after typing an extensive response, my computer crashed while i was doing
something else. so i will attempt to reconstruct it and answer your questions in my next edit.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Oct 27, 2019 12:47:29 GMT
Please explain to me with rationality, insight and logic what eternal life is? What form does it take, why is it eternal and how is it eternal? * { i shall give you the condensed version for clarity, with the understanding that i can supply chapter and verse for every word. otherwise i should spend hours referencing, typing and retyping for hours additional to annotate. [i'm not a very good typist] these ideas are the gist of the key concepts from numerous places in scripture excerpted for brevity.} *
for ease of understanding eternal life, i recommend reading - in it's entirety - the Gospel of John -
in the new american standard or the new king james version.
[ John 1 : 1 -18 and John 3 : 1 - 17 . other passages will supply additional details for some of it ]
(especially Jn 3: 16 - " For God so loved the world that he gave His Only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. " )
God made man from the dust of the earth. we fell into sin in the garden of eden. we inherited an inclination to sin from our fallen nature. all have sinned and are in need of a Savior. from before the foundation of the world, God made plans for the salvation of man.
to redeem mankind from sin, a perfect Holy God requires a perfect sinless sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus the Son of God. John the baptist said of Him "behold the lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world". Jn 1 :29
John baptized Jesus and the Holy Spirit landed upon Him in the form of a dove. the Father in heaven spoke and said this is my beloved Son, hear Him. after Jesus was tempted in the desert 40 days of the devil, Jesus began His ministry. preaching the fulfillment of prophesies concerning Himself as the Messiah from the time He opened the scroll in the temple to the Book of Isaiah.
when Jesus was born angels sang glory to God. he performed miracles. gave sight to the blind. raised the dead. fed the multitudes. cast out demons. many more astounding miracles than we have record of. so everywhere He went the Gospel was preached and was confirmed by the irrefutable Acts of God.
so a rabbi named Nicodemus came at night to Jesus and said we know that You are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs unless God is with him. Jesus told him " unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." the rabbi didn't understand.
so Jesus told him " unless one is born of the water and the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of heaven. that which is born of the flesh is flesh. that which is born of the spirit is spirit." Jn 3 : 3-6
the eternal God breathed life into the dust. made us in His image. the Holy Spirit created in the virgin Mary a saviour, who is Christ the Lord. now, the Eternal God offers us eternal life through and in His Son. Who died for all the sins of man, and Rose in His Own Body from the dead.
the people from all over would travel to the holy land for the day of pentecost. after Jesus' resurrection, He told them to wait until they received power from on high. the Holy Spirit landed upon the apostles. Peter in Acts 2 told the people they crucified the Son of God.
every man there from all around the world heard the gospel in their own language. ( another miracle ). they were convicted of their sin and said men and brethren what must we do ?
Peter said " repent ( turn away from sin ) and let everyone of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; ( sin is washed away ), and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Acts 2 : 38
"those who gladly received his word were baptized" ( Acts 2 : 41) ; and so the Lord started His Church with 3000 people
on the day of pentecost almost 2000 years ago.
we are buried with Christ in baptism ( like John the baptist with Jesus in the river Jordan ). all of ours sins are washed away by the sacrifice of the sinless Jesus. ( buried with him in baptism, raised to walk in newness of Life with the Holy Spirit within us. a new spiritual life, partakers of the divine nature of the Resurrected Son of God.) Eternal Life begins.
Jesus said " I am the Way, the Truth and the Life ". he who believes in me has passed from death to life.
"I Am the resurrection and the Life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And he who believes in Me shall never die" Jn 11 : 25,26
you might say our journey to our new home in heaven with God has thus begun. a spiritual transformation has taken place when the Holy Spirit resides within our body, spirit and soul. we are the children of God Himself sharing His Divine Nature through the workings of the Father, Jesus the Son of God, and the Holy Spirit.
as God breathed life into the dust to create a man in His Image, so now God has breathed into us the Holy Spirit of Eternal Life. He has preserved for us His Words in the bible. we are born again unto eternal life in the person of Jesus Christ until He returns for those who are His Own - the called -. we are the ones who hear the good shepherds voice.
once before He gave His Life that we might live. and now He freely gives us of His Life eternally.
" I Am the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end, " says the Lord , "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty" Rev 1 : 8
from eternity past, to time without end , He offers us His Eternal Life. now and forever in heaven with God
Please understand that quoting the bible does not strengthen your case. Atheists view it as about as realistic as The Lord of the Rings, so when it becomes a primary reason why you believe your religion, it makes you less believable. Why do you believe anything in the bible ?
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Post by phludowin on Oct 27, 2019 13:41:27 GMT
what is worth giving up eternal life in heaven for ? There is no eternal life in heaven. You can't give up what doesn't exist.
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Post by gadreel on Oct 28, 2019 20:56:41 GMT
You have 'proven' nothing that is relevant. You have not answered my request that you back up your assertion with the definitions I have politely requested ( because you can't, claiming that they are in the links) e.g where does it say exactly what specific gene is connect with what specific religion? It is irrelevant what multiple professionals in multiple associated fields have to say on this main assertion of mine that DNA is NOT linked to religion. They are NOT the relevant professionals to answer this question. There is NO gene linked scientifically with any religion.
Prove there is and I will say you are correct. I don't think anyone has made the claim that a gene is linked to any specific religion, that would be like claiming that someone had a specific gene to attract them to another specific individual. Also no one thinks sexual orientation (any more than artistic, musical or linguistic ability) is determined by any single gene. The genetic component would be a collection of genes in all of these cases, and I'd see no reason for receptiveness to religion to be any different. It's not hard to google "scientific study of genetics and religious behavior". Here is a top hit: New Scientist: Genes contribute to religious inclination Yeah she has not read anything that I have posted, and now apparently I am holier than thou because I wont jump through her hoops. that link you provided was the first one I linked, then I followed it up with a number of different links, interestingly they have had the answers to the questions Goz is asking.
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Post by goz on Oct 28, 2019 21:03:55 GMT
I don't think anyone has made the claim that a gene is linked to any specific religion, that would be like claiming that someone had a specific gene to attract them to another specific individual. Also no one thinks sexual orientation (any more than artistic, musical or linguistic ability) is determined by any single gene. The genetic component would be a collection of genes in all of these cases, and I'd see no reason for receptiveness to religion to be any different. It's not hard to google "scientific study of genetics and religious behavior". Here is a top hit: New Scientist: Genes contribute to religious inclinationYeah she has not read anything that I have posted, and now apparently I am holier than thou because I wont jump through her hoops. that link you provided was the first one I linked, then I followed it up with a number of different links, interestingly they have had the answers to the questions Goz is asking. HOLY CRAP! NOT AGAIN! For the umpteenth time for the dummies, THAT study shows no genetic component to whatever 'religious inclination' is. Religious inclination is not even defined Since the term is not defined other than attendance at church and discussion of religious themes, this is a bullshit unscientific study done by a psychology graduate student and NOT a scientist in genetics. I can't believe you are all this stupid. WHAT genes, combination of genes or rafts of them contribute to what ever is definable as being religious? WTF IS scientifically being religious that would even be capable of having ANY study?
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Post by thefleetsin on Oct 28, 2019 21:15:23 GMT
calculating caliphates over centuries of conventional conundrums
there are no angels to better our natures. only far-flung excuses reused through out the ages.
of why we're doing this or screwing that. as it's being recorded by the same bought off sages our fathers had on their payrolls.
limitless space, and all we generate are black holes. as the ranks are filed in their regal rolls. calling all ne'er-do-wells to infest the polls rearrange theocracy before it's far too old.
sjw 10/28/19 inspired at this very moment in time as the portal shines right through the divine.
from the 'blasphemy series' of poems
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Post by gadreel on Oct 28, 2019 21:35:55 GMT
Yeah she has not read anything that I have posted, and now apparently I am holier than thou because I wont jump through her hoops. that link you provided was the first one I linked, then I followed it up with a number of different links, interestingly they have had the answers to the questions Goz is asking. HOLY CRAP! NOT AGAIN! For the umpteenth time for the dummies, THAT study shows no genetic component to whatever 'religious inclination' is. Religious inclination is not even defined Since the term is not defined other than attendance at church and discussion of religious themes, this is a bullshit unscientific study done by a psychology graduate student and NOT a scientist in genetics. I can't believe you are all this stupid. WHAT genes, combination of genes or rafts of them contribute to what ever is definable as being religious? WTF IS scientifically being religious that would even be capable of having ANY study?
You realise you are not required to respond to me when I talk to another person right?
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Post by goz on Oct 28, 2019 21:56:55 GMT
HOLY CRAP! NOT AGAIN! For the umpteenth time for the dummies, THAT study shows no genetic component to whatever 'religious inclination' is. Religious inclination is not even defined Since the term is not defined other than attendance at church and discussion of religious themes, this is a bullshit unscientific study done by a psychology graduate student and NOT a scientist in genetics. I can't believe you are all this stupid. WHAT genes, combination of genes or rafts of them contribute to what ever is definable as being religious? WTF IS scientifically being religious that would even be capable of having ANY study?
You realise you are not required to respond to me when I talk to another person right? If you feel like this, then feel free to PM the person you wish to speak to in private, otherwise this is an open message board for open discussion of anyone's posts and whatever is said on any thread.
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Post by gadreel on Oct 28, 2019 22:03:16 GMT
You realise you are not required to respond to me when I talk to another person right? If you feel like this, then feel free to PM the person you wish to speak to in private, otherwise this is an open message board for open discussion of anyone's posts and whatever is said on any thread. My response was in light of your exasperated cries of NOT AGAIN. I spoke to someone on a message board, I am happy for people to reply, but maybe if they feel the need to have a little cry before responding they could do with examining their motivations. Sorry so you undertstand. Dont respond to me if it is such a trial on your mental health that you need to preface the response OH NO NOT AGAIN!!1!!11 reeeeeeeee. For your own sake, not mine, I dont care what you type, I can choose to respond or ignore it.
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Post by general313 on Oct 28, 2019 23:39:40 GMT
I don't think anyone has made the claim that a gene is linked to any specific religion, that would be like claiming that someone had a specific gene to attract them to another specific individual. Also no one thinks sexual orientation (any more than artistic, musical or linguistic ability) is determined by any single gene. The genetic component would be a collection of genes in all of these cases, and I'd see no reason for receptiveness to religion to be any different. It's not hard to google "scientific study of genetics and religious behavior". Here is a top hit: New Scientist: Genes contribute to religious inclinationYeah she has not read anything that I have posted, and now apparently I am holier than thou because I wont jump through her hoops. that link you provided was the first one I linked, then I followed it up with a number of different links, interestingly they have had the answers to the questions Goz is asking. She seems to have made a conclusion that belief in religion is irrational (a reasonable one in and of itself in my opinion). But then she makes the erroneous leap to thinking that religious behavior cannot be studied scientifically. It would be like saying that psychologists cannot ever study schizophrenic behavior because that behavior is irrational.
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Post by general313 on Oct 28, 2019 23:52:55 GMT
Yeah she has not read anything that I have posted, and now apparently I am holier than thou because I wont jump through her hoops. that link you provided was the first one I linked, then I followed it up with a number of different links, interestingly they have had the answers to the questions Goz is asking. HOLY CRAP! NOT AGAIN! For the umpteenth time for the dummies, THAT study shows no genetic component to whatever 'religious inclination' is. Religious inclination is not even defined Since the term is not defined other than attendance at church and discussion of religious themes, this is a bullshit unscientific study done by a psychology graduate student and NOT a scientist in genetics. I can't believe you are all this stupid. WHAT genes, combination of genes or rafts of them contribute to what ever is definable as being religious? WTF IS scientifically being religious that would even be capable of having ANY study? Identifying specific genes related to a particular trait is not the first step in a genetic study, it is usually the last step. When Gregor Mendel did his experiments on pea plants, he had no idea which genes produced the observed traits in his experiments, and in fact the discovery of DNA was to come many decades later. He was however able to correctly deduce inheritance from both parents and become aware of dominant and recessive traits. The "bullshit unscientific study" was done at a university by a team and reported in a science magazine. They may well be wrong but their methodology seems like a reasonable early step to me.
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Post by gadreel on Oct 28, 2019 23:55:58 GMT
Yeah she has not read anything that I have posted, and now apparently I am holier than thou because I wont jump through her hoops. that link you provided was the first one I linked, then I followed it up with a number of different links, interestingly they have had the answers to the questions Goz is asking. She seems to have made a conclusion that belief in religion is irrational (a reasonable one in and of itself in my opinion). But then she makes the erroneous leap to thinking that religious behavior cannot be studied scientifically. It would be like saying that psychologists cannot ever study schizophrenic behavior because that behavior is irrational. No, I mean she actually has a point, the first link (because it is a popular science article) is a bit thin on the ground in terms of references, of course what she fails in is that I provided more information, and the details she specifically asks for are in those links. of course it is all moot, she made a blanket statement without any kind of citations to back it up and it turns out that at least some ofthe relevant professionals (including the ones that Goz deems are relevant) do not agree with that statement, which is all I intended to show.
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Post by goz on Oct 29, 2019 4:40:49 GMT
HOLY CRAP! NOT AGAIN! For the umpteenth time for the dummies, THAT study shows no genetic component to whatever 'religious inclination' is. Religious inclination is not even defined Since the term is not defined other than attendance at church and discussion of religious themes, this is a bullshit unscientific study done by a psychology graduate student and NOT a scientist in genetics. I can't believe you are all this stupid. WHAT genes, combination of genes or rafts of them contribute to what ever is definable as being religious? WTF IS scientifically being religious that would even be capable of having ANY study? Identifying specific genes related to a particular trait is not the first step in a genetic study, it is usually the last step. When Gregor Mendel did his experiments on pea plants, he had no idea which genes produced the observed traits in his experiments, and in fact the discovery of DNA was to come many decades later. He was however able to correctly deduce inheritance from both parents and become aware of dominant and recessive traits. The "bullshit unscientific study" was done at a university by a team and reported in a science magazine. They may well be wrong but their methodology seems like a reasonable early step to me. No. The first step in any scientific experiment is to isolate an hypothesis, then one has to define things so that you know whether what you find, is actually what you were looking for in the first place. This requires specific definitions. My main point is that religiousness is not defined adequately for a bona fide scientific experiment/study. IF you then extrapolate that to the last step which is stating that there is a genetic component to something, you must then isolate exactly what that genetic component is. In the studies given, this has not happened.
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