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Post by Daisy on Apr 1, 2018 19:27:10 GMT
This, of course, fails to show that the MCU wouldn’t have even been attempted if not for Superman 1978. However, it is evidence that the tone of the MCU movies have been influenced by Superman 1978. The lighthearted approach, the mix of camp and drama ... all the things DC fans criticize about the MCU ... came from Superman 1978. Which mean they’ve been dumping on Superman 1978 all this time, without even realizing it! Nope, Superman wasn't cracking jokes and 1-liners while the earthquake was happening or while he was fighting Zod, Ursa, and Non. Superman didn't call those a "party" like Iron Man called the Chitauri invasion and killing of hundreds of people a "party". Superman is dull and always has been. Ever since his inception it's been; 'screw personality, he can fly!'
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Post by Daisy on Apr 1, 2018 19:44:21 GMT
I don't have a problem giving props to Superman. As you said, there were super powered characters before Superman but he did kinda focus the idea into the template a little better. Maybe it was inevitable that characters like that would rise up, but someone did have to be first. It just kills formersamhmd to have to admit that MCU owes its existence to Superman: The Movie. Superman: The Movie owes its existence to Flash Gordon! Flash! A-ah! Savior of the universe!
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Post by harpospoke on Apr 1, 2018 19:46:18 GMT
Not really the same thing is it? S:TM was of course the godfather for everything that followed, but the specific idea to do a shared universe was Marvel's. If they were only taking cues from S:TM obviously it would have been standalone stories like all the other CB movies. MCU did take a cue from DC to do a shared universe. Superman: The Movie was the 1st movie in the 1st shared cinematic universe for superhero movies. DC already created a shared cinematic universe a quarter-century before MCU. That's where MCU got the idea to do a shared cinematic universe. By copying the Superman movies. I don't think you know what a shared universe is. Oh..."planning". Yeah they were "planning" for how many decades? What a coincidence that DC just happens to finally get their "plans" together when it was time to do a DCU. Let's see if it works both ways. We know that the Russo brothers were "planning" a Civil War Cap story long before BvS was announced....let me guess..that doesn't count, right? Nope, it doesn't work both ways. In Wonder Woman's case, Joss Whedon actually wrote a script for a Wonder Woman movie so we know for a fact that a Wonder Woman movie was planned before MCU even began. There's no evidence at all of any script for Civil War prior to the BvS announcement so there's no solid evidence at all that CIvil War was ever planned before the BvS announcement. Except we know Marvel had already done the story in the comics and it was a big deal. It was going to happen obviously with or without BvS. Are you sure you want to claim that Marvel had less time to make CW than DC had to make BvS and yet Marvel turned out the better movie by a mile?
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Post by harpospoke on Apr 1, 2018 19:47:54 GMT
So...now Marvel didn't copy SM:TM? You should pick a stance on this one. MCU used Superman: The Movie as the template for most of their movies (even MCU Dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that), but MCU also dumbed down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners. You just claimed both again. Make up your mind. Did Marvel copy S:TM or did they do it differently?
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Post by ThatGuy on Apr 1, 2018 20:07:04 GMT
MCU used Superman: The Movie as the template for most of their movies (even MCU Dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that), but MCU also dumbed down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners. You just claimed both again. Make up your mind. Did Marvel copy S:TM or did they do it differently? He can't say that they copied them because he'd admit that the MCU makes good movies. At the same time he can't say that they copied them, because he'd then be saying that Superman: The Movie was a bad movie.
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Post by sostie on Apr 1, 2018 22:01:09 GMT
So...now Marvel didn't copy SM:TM? You should pick a stance on this one. MCU used Superman: The Movie as the template for most of their movies (even MCU Dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that), but MCU also dumbed down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners. Have you seen Batman & Robin. DC were sure not guilty of "dumbing down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners." eh?
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Post by sostie on Apr 1, 2018 22:08:30 GMT
Not really the same thing is it? S:TM was of course the godfather for everything that followed, but the specific idea to do a shared universe was Marvel's. If they were only taking cues from S:TM obviously it would have been standalone stories like all the other CB movies. MCU did take a cue from DC to do a shared universe. Superman: The Movie was the 1st movie in the 1st shared cinematic universe for superhero movies. DC already created a shared cinematic universe a quarter-century before MCU. That's where MCU got the idea to do a shared cinematic universe. By copying the Superman movies. Firstly, to call the Superman movies and Supergirl an example of a shared universe is a stretch...to imply that was an influential aspect of the films is hilarious Secondly, you have been told this several times, and as before, will continue to ignore it....DC DID NOT HAVE ANY INVOLVEMENT IN THE PRODUCTION OF THE SALKIND SUPERMAN MOVIES. But well done for giving credit for an influence that doesn't exist to an organisation that didn't provide it!!!
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Post by ThatGuy on Apr 1, 2018 22:24:46 GMT
MCU used Superman: The Movie as the template for most of their movies (even MCU Dictator Kevin Feige has admitted that), but MCU also dumbed down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners. Have you seen Batman & Robin. DC were sure not guilty of "dumbing down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners." eh? Batman Forever, also. They went the opposite direction of Burton movies because parents complained. Had to sell those Happy Meals.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 22:35:50 GMT
Have you seen Batman & Robin. DC were sure not guilty of "dumbing down their movies for the kiddies and added bad jokes and 1-liners." eh? Batman Forever, also. They went the opposite direction of Burton movies because parents complained. Had to sell those Happy Meals. Even the Burton movies had their silly scenes and jokes.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 22:36:39 GMT
This, of course, fails to show that the MCU wouldn’t have even been attempted if not for Superman 1978. However, it is evidence that the tone of the MCU movies have been influenced by Superman 1978. The lighthearted approach, the mix of camp and drama ... all the things DC fans criticize about the MCU ... came from Superman 1978. Which mean they’ve been dumping on Superman 1978 all this time, without even realizing it! Nope, Superman wasn't cracking jokes and 1-liners while the earthquake was happening or while he was fighting Zod, Ursa, and Non. No, the joking was left to Luthor and he sadistically tortured Zod with a big grin on his face instead.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 22:38:30 GMT
Superman: The Movie was the 1st movie in the 1st shared cinematic universe for superhero movies. No, it BOTCHED the concept of the Shared Universe right from the start. As usual, Marvel had to clean up DC's mess. They had decades to do WW but only really put effort in after the MCU started. They needed the MCU to do the real work for them.
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Post by Nicko's Nose on Apr 1, 2018 23:30:14 GMT
Superman: The Movie Continues To Influence Marvel & DC Films By Cooper Hood
06.08.2017The superhero movie genre has never been as popular as it is today, but both Marvel Studios and DC Films continue to use Richard Donner’s Superman: The Movie as an example to strive towards. Released back in 1978, director Richard Donner delivered an origin story for Superman that has so far gone unmatched. The Christopher Reeve starred flick took audiences on a journey as Clark Kent learned of his abilities and went on to save the day in typical hero fashion, and the way the film unfolds has kept it in the conversation to be one of the best superhero films of all-time. The target audience for the modern superhero genre may not have been around back when Donner’s first Superman movie hit theaters, but it has left a lasting impression on all who watch it – including some of the most powerful men in the superhero movie genre today. The Academy honored Donner’s storied career yesterday and had many familiar names on hand to share stories of his influence. Two of the men in attendance were none other than Marvel Studios president Kevin Feige and DC Films president Geoff Johns – both of whom were former assistants to the Donners. As noted by IGN, both men pointed to Superman as being hugely influential to the movies they are working to make right now – where Johns called it “the greatest superhero movie film still, ever.” Feige noted that he’s made a practice to rewatch the perfect origin story before they begin every MCU production: "Superman: The Movie is still to this day the archetype of the perfect superhero film origin story and we watch it before we make almost any one of our films, and that’s been the case for the past seventeen years since I left the fold to go work for Marvel."Marvel DC Comics Superheroes Superman: The Movie Continues To Influence Marvel & DC Film Projects Even though fans on both sides of Marvel/DC camps have created a rivalry between the properties, it goes to show just how similar they actually are. Marvel and DC’s films may be different in their style, approach, and/or tone, but with using Superman as their goal, they are drawing from the same source. Marvel has made its fair share of great origin stories already with Iron Man particularly standing out, but they’ve also adopted a similarly light-hearted tone that Superman had and kept the focus on the heroes – both when they are and are not saving the day. With more potential origin stories coming, Feige and company should prepare to watch Superman many more times. DC meanwhile has also pulled from Superman, with the most recent release of Wonder Woman being a shining example of that. This was very intentional on the part of director Patty Jenkins as she’s repeatedly cited Superman as inspiration for her vision. She even included plenty of callback sequences in the film, most notably reenacting the alley fight, but with the roles switched and Diana saving the day. As both cinematic universes move forward, we should only continue to see Superman have an influence on what they produce. formersamhmd just got owned! Actually you just “owned” yourself by saying someone got “owned” like a 13 year old for the 645th time or so.
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Post by ThatGuy on Apr 2, 2018 0:07:21 GMT
Superman: The Movie was the 1st movie in the 1st shared cinematic universe for superhero movies. No, it BOTCHED the concept of the Shared Universe right from the start. As usual, Marvel had to clean up DC's mess. They had decades to do WW but only really put effort in after the MCU started. They needed the MCU to do the real work for them. I don't think he understands that you can submit a script that isn't actually planned to be made into a movie. I can submit a Blackhawk Squadron script right now, but that doesn't mean they planned for a BhS movie to be made. If they like the script or the pitch for it then it might be bought off you and may be made into a movie. Even for a big name like a Joss Whedon.
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Post by ThatGuy on Apr 2, 2018 0:10:05 GMT
formersamhmd just got owned! Actually you just “owned” yourself by saying someone got “owned” like a 13 year old for the 645th time or so. Do people even say "owned" anymore?
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Apr 2, 2018 1:54:00 GMT
If the Christopher Reeves Superman films are considered a share universe, then it's a pretty sad one. One spin-off with Supergirl even though they could have brought in Batman or the flash into the mix? Hell even Wonder Woman would have been nice.
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Post by sostie on Apr 2, 2018 2:32:14 GMT
Firstly, to call the Superman movies and Supergirl an example of a shared universe is a stretch No, it isn't as stretch. It's a fact. The Wright brothers 1st flight traveled just 120 feet and last only 12 seconds, at a speed of 6.8 MPH. The altitude was about 10 feet above the ground. That's nothing like the trans-Continental flights that commercial passenger jets routinely make every day in 2018, but nevertheless it still counts as the 1st controlled, sustained flight of a motor-powered aircraft in human history. What the fuck are you talking about. The so called shared universe in Superman/Supergirl did not influence the MCU to do the same. If anything, their own comics did Actually the Salkinds owned the screen rights, not DC DC did not make the first shared (according to you) universe film because they weren't involved in the making of the films. Stop wasting my time and think before you reply.
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Post by Daisy on Apr 2, 2018 3:12:37 GMT
The so called shared universe in Superman/Supergirl did not influence the MCU to do the same. If anything, their own comics did 1st, there's no evidence at all that MCU was influenced to create a shared universe because of their comics and not because of the Christopher Reeves Superman movies and Supergirl doing it 1st. 2nd, to say that MCU wasn't influenced to create a shared universe by the Christopher Reeves Superman movies and Supergirl doing it a quarter-century before MCU began is as incorrect and arrogant as if the NBA were to say that they weren't influenced to have the 3-point shot by the ABL and ABA (both of which used the 3-point shot long before the NBA adopted it) or if the NFL were to say that they weren't influenced to have the 2-point conversion by college football and the AFL (both of which used the 2-point conversion long before the NFL adopted it). How is it that Batman v Superman, Wonder Woman, and Justice League all failed to make a billion dollars while Captain America: Civil War, Iron Man 3, Black Panther, Age of Ultron, and The Avengers all managed to make at least $1.153 billion dollars?
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Post by Nicko's Nose on Apr 2, 2018 3:21:20 GMT
Lol at DC-Fan’s stupid analogies.
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Post by harpospoke on Apr 2, 2018 4:43:11 GMT
No, it BOTCHED the concept of the Shared Universe right from the start. As usual, Marvel had to clean up DC's mess. They had decades to do WW but only really put effort in after the MCU started. They needed the MCU to do the real work for them. I don't think he understands that you can submit a script that isn't actually planned to be made into a movie. I can submit a Blackhawk Squadron script right now, but that doesn't mean they planned for a BhS movie to be made. If they like the script or the pitch for it then it might be bought off you and may be made into a movie. Even for a big name like a Joss Whedon. Yeah, some people don't understand how Hollywood works. There are scripts floating around all over the place. That doesn't mean every possible concept in those scripts is "planned".
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Post by harpospoke on Apr 2, 2018 4:47:56 GMT
I don't think you know what a shared universe is. A shared universe is what DC had a quarter century before MCU. Not even close. No amount of fanboy blindness can twist reality that much. The closest it ever existed was with some franchises putting characters together after the public was losing interest as a gimmick. Only Marvel had it in mind from the start. Are you sure you want to claim that Marvel had less time to make CW than DC had to make BvS and yet Marvel turned out the better movie by a mile? BvS is a mch better movie than Civil War. Civil War was a badly-written movie. The villain (Zemo) was weak and the villain's plan was convoluted and made no sense at all. There was no reason at all for Iron Man and Cap to fight. And the cameos by Ant-Man, Hawkeye, and Spider-Kid were lame and added nothing to the movie. Ok it's possible to like any movie more than another movie. But obviously Marvel appealed to a lot more people with CW than DC did with BvS. No movie will please everyone, but Marvel is hitting the mark a LOT more than DC is.
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