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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 14:38:12 GMT
I've heard. But you can't superimpose the dynamics of one fanbase onto to another and claim that's what's going on and the same reasons are behind it. But in this case, it's the exact same situation. According to you, but it's not provable. It's just your personal opinion. One thread of opinions from one forum does not a fanbase make. No! It's not like Dune! You can't superimpose rules from another sci-fantasy genre's universe onto SW. That's called fanfic! You work within the established rules of that particular universe as previously exemplified. Survival skills are not substitutes for actually using the Force, or firsthand experience, or specified training. It doesn't make you instantly be able to do anything that you've never done before in the Force. And didn't the Fremen train particular skills that they used before? And also train new skills that Mau'Deeb taught them?... I think I'm remembering that correctly. Sorry, but I'm not buying that one has to be a complete failure for the other one to shine (which seems to be Disney's mentality). In the PT when Anakin and ObiWan fought side-by-side, did one of them have to be a complete failure for the other to shine? No. When Han, Luke, and Leia fought in the OT, did any of them have to be complete failures? No, they all had successes and moments of competency. Huh? That's not what I saw onscreen. But you would expect that he wasn't as agile as he used to be considering his advanced age. After all, Yoda wasn't jumping around during training Luke in TESB. And we know Yoda died of old age halfway through ROTJ.
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Post by poelzig on Apr 1, 2018 14:56:04 GMT
Yes, it can. It just isn't the fluffy-wuffy "And they all lived happily ever after" nonsense the fanatical OT fans wanted. The irony with your comments is always so delicious. Too bad you're too simple minded to enjoy it.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 15:53:05 GMT
But in this case, it's the exact same situation. According to you, but it's not provable. It's just your personal opinion. Not just mine. You read that thread I posted? The audience reaction score aligns quite nicely with it. Same principle. Fending for yourself in a harsh environment breeds strength. Tell that to Force Sensitives who have no problem using whatever connection to the Force they have to do stuff without training. Like Luke being able to do Telekinesis in ESB despite Kenobi not teaching him that. Their training was just basic Arrakis survival stuff. And a lot of them didn't get the Weirding Way training either. They were just that tough. Kenobi did have to be sidelined to show off Anakin, yes. Because only one was the Jedi warrior out of the three. Keep Luke around at full power in the ST, there's no need for Rey because her thing is that SHE'S the Jedi Warrior now. He was only in his early 50s in the OT if he was Ewan's age at the end of the PT (around 34) and you add 19 to it. Still good enough shape to fight. Yeah, and after all the stuff we saw him do in the PT it DIDN'T make sense he'd not do anything in the OT.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 15:54:01 GMT
Yes, it can. It just isn't the fluffy-wuffy "And they all lived happily ever after" nonsense the fanatical OT fans wanted. The irony with your comments is always so delicious. Too bad you're too simple minded to enjoy it. Why? The MCU doesn't do fluffy0wuffy "And they all lived Happily ever after" nonsense either. That's more DC's schtick these days.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Apr 1, 2018 16:46:04 GMT
The irony with your comments is always so delicious. Too bad you're too simple minded to enjoy it. Why? The MCU doesn't do fluffy0wuffy "And they all lived Happily ever after" nonsense either. That's more DC's schtick these days. MCU is the epitome of juvenile, stake-less kiddy junk food pandering to the lowest common denominator. It's an abomination designed to appeal to the dumb masses sporting idiotic penis, turd and nipple dialogue. It even manages to trivialize and infantilize the the shallow comic source materials, eg Civil War has Cap dying which of course did does not happen in the silly film, not even lame side characters die, but Cap and IM clobber each other because of mommy issues. The Ragnarök myth has Thor, Odin, Loki & Co die brutally, Thor Fragglerock the film does not, it has Thor crying like a little girl when he gets a haircut and getting his ass kicked by his retconned-in sister.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 16:51:45 GMT
Why? The MCU doesn't do fluffy0wuffy "And they all lived Happily ever after" nonsense either. That's more DC's schtick these days. MCU is the epitome of Being unashamed and unpretentious, instead of pandering to the artsy-fartsy crowd who get high on their own delusions of eloquence. You want something juvenile, using the Holocaust to justify a character is juvenile. If you read the comic you'd know he didn't die. Real issues, instead of "1% chances". One cycle end and then another new cycle begin where the dead come back to life. It's not some "End-all" Apocalypse. It even has Surtr be the one to destroy Asgard, which happens.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Apr 1, 2018 17:01:53 GMT
Raccooon turd² One cycle end and then another new cycle begin where the dead come back to life. It's not some "End-all" Apocalypse. It even has Surtr be the one to destroy Asgard, which happens.Blah blah deflective nonsense. It's the Doom of the Gods. Show me one Ragnarök myth version (Germanic or Norse) where Thor, Loki, Odin etc did not die brutally (mauled by the wolf or Midgard serpent). You cant because its just not Fragglrock: the bastardized, dumbed down Dineyland version of Ragnarök with rock songs. Hideous. As if we have WW II be fought with laser guns...ooops that happened in Cap I. As I said an abomination. holy raccoon turd, Iron Man! Ok, then he dies in the "aftermath" of Civil War technically in the "The Death of Captain America" which was still not in the MCU, he still lives happily ever after. Don't try to deflect so cheaply. These films have no stakes.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 17:31:15 GMT
Raccooon turd² One cycle end and then another new cycle begin where the dead come back to life. It's not some "End-all" Apocalypse. It even has Surtr be the one to destroy Asgard, which happens.Blah blah deflective nonsense. No, just treating Ragnarok like Ragnarok and not some bland generic Apocalypse wannabe. Doom of one Cycle of Gods, then the start of a later one. They took a few minor liberties in who died and who didn't (as opposed to Wonder Woman, which ran roughshod over the Gods of Olympus) but they were true to how Ragnarok isn't le absolut fin du monde. As opposed to WW having WWI be fought with Magic Gas. He didn't really die in that story either, he was in suspended animation everyone assumed was death. They aren't going to kill off everyone and destroy the world every movie, that's the lazy way out. The DC and Fox way out.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 17:35:51 GMT
According to you, but it's not provable. It's just your personal opinion. Not just mine. You read that thread I posted? Still amounts to personal opinions that have an agenda. They're not facts and not provable. Scores don't reveal motives, just trends. It's a straw man conclusion. Strength, not Force proficiency. Still building straw men. Luke performed one trick under very desperate circumstances, with an immense amount of concentration, and it took a lot of time. If the Wampa wasn't distracted by eating... Was Luke competing against another Force user when he did that? And against a trained Force user no less? What did Luke learn more from - survival skills or a training from master Yoda? Which one progressed him faster and farther? I clearly remember Mau'Deeb training him in his ways and skills that were previously unique to him. So I think you're stretching truths. On top of that, as I said it's a separate universe. You're latching on to fanfic stuff and trying to paste it overtop SW. And that's what the ST is - bad SW fanfic. No he didn't. Not in the true sense of the word. Not like this ST nonsense. There were moments ObiWan was sidelined. But they fought alongside each other in battle and complemented each other. That's indisputable. Not true. As I showed above, we've already seen previous examples of Jedi fighting alongside each other and complementing each other. We already know it can work. Your thinking is pathetic Disney thinking that is actually guilty of what you accuse misogynists wanting to see happen to Rey. You're guilty of the crime you are outraged over. It makes sense. He's on the verge of dying age. Sorry that sinks your argument.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 17:48:45 GMT
Not just mine. You read that thread I posted? Still amounts to personal opinions that have an agenda. They're not facts and not provable. By that logic, nothing is provable. Force sensitivity happens at random, and it can correlate to a person's physical well being. It didn't take him that long, really. He didn't learn all that much from Yoda, he was only there for a few days at most. A lot was self-taught. By your logic, absolutely anything that tries something new is fanfic. Barely. And even then ATOC had him gone from Anakin most of the time and in ROTS. We had a few minutes of Obi-Wan and Anakin together in the entire PT, at most. My crime is that I didn't think having Rey be some useless tagalong would be a good idea. And given how the OT fans saw Luke, they wouldn't accept her as anything BUT a useless tagalong. It's her story and not Lukes', deal with it. What's Obi-Wan's excuse? He wasn't that old.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 19:03:09 GMT
Still amounts to personal opinions that have an agenda. They're not facts and not provable. By that logic, nothing is provable. Not true. Facts and evidence are proof. Opinions are aren't. If that were true then Leia had no business being Mary Poppins through space. You're just making it up as you go along. I disagree. And judging by your comprehension problems I have no reason to question my own opinion. Most of it was not self taught. Very rarely did he do anything without Yoda's presence or guidance in his training. You're outright lying about it. And according to the novelization of TESB Luke trained for several weeks, not a few days. You say you've followed SW for decades. But you clearly don't know SW. Laughably so. Nope! You can add as much new stuff as you want. It just has to harmonize with what came before it. That's not what I saw onscreen. You're omitting the times they did fight together. Not to mention we the examples of all the Jedi fighting together and complementing each other in the Geonosis arena. Your argument is weak because I've already cited too many onscreen examples. I'm not responsible for you pretending that they didn't happen. Nope! It was much more than that. See above. And ObiWan and QuiGon fought together. Lots of examples. You're wrong. You don't know SW. Nope! That's your lying accusation. But in fact, you're the one insisting that 2 Jedi can't both shine alongside each other. You're a hypocrite. You're more guilty of the things you insist all OT fans are guilty of. You're just a Rey worshipping ST troll. LULZ Seriously?!? Did you just say he wasn't that old?... I'm not going to make anymore time for a Disney shill/Rey worshipping troll with the comprehension level of a 3 year old. LULZ!! I need to have an intelligent conversation about SW. And you clearly ain't providing it anymore.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 22:34:52 GMT
By that logic, nothing is provable. Not true. Facts and evidence are proof. Opinions are aren't. There's nothing that could convince you then, because you disregard opinions of many and being irrelevant. Why not? Vader was worse off than her and had Force powers still. Guess we have to leave it at that. Anything he learnt between ESB and ROTJ was self-taught. Han and Leia didn't act like they'd been flying around in the Falcon for weeks, the movie made it looks more like hours. Novelization needs better work. By that logic, no sequels to the OT could ever happen with some new crisis because the end of the OT was essentially "Happily ever after, no continuation with a new threat possible." Which were far and few. And you're ignoring how ANH killed off Obi-Wan to get Luke alone. [quote[Nope! It was much more than that. See above. And ObiWan and QuiGon fought together.[/quote] Yes, and then Qui-Gon was killed. See the pattern here? Apparently it's okay for Obi-Wan to have Qui-Gon killed and okay for Luke to have Obi-Wan killed but it's wrong for Luke to be out of the way so Rey can be the heroine of her story. Qui-Gon was eliminated, Obi-Wan was eliminated. Nothing wrong with eliminating Luke. No, he wasn't. If we was the same age as Ewn was when he went to Tatooine at the end of ROTS (34 or so) then he's only 53 or so by ANH. Unless he REALLY let himself go, he's not old enough to be as lame a fighter as he was in ANH.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 1, 2018 23:09:29 GMT
So basically formersamhmd got bored of trolling the X-Men and MCU boards.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 23:54:45 GMT
So basically formersamhmd got bored of trolling the X-Men and MCU boards. It's not even good trolling...
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 2, 2018 0:00:46 GMT
Not true. Facts and evidence are proof. Opinions are aren't. There's nothing that could convince you then, because you disregard opinions of many and being irrelevant. Why not? Vader was worse off than her and had Force powers still. Guess we have to leave it at that. Anything he learnt between ESB and ROTJ was self-taught. Han and Leia didn't act like they'd been flying around in the Falcon for weeks, the movie made it looks more like hours. Novelization needs better work. By that logic, no sequels to the OT could ever happen with some new crisis because the end of the OT was essentially "Happily ever after, no continuation with a new threat possible." Yes, and then Qui-Gon was killed. See the pattern here? Apparently it's okay for Obi-Wan to have Qui-Gon killed and okay for Luke to have Obi-Wan killed but it's wrong for Luke to be out of the way so Rey can be the heroine of her story. Qui-Gon was eliminated, Obi-Wan was eliminated. Nothing wrong with eliminating Luke. No, he wasn't. If we was the same age as Ewn was when he went to Tatooine at the end of ROTS (34 or so) then he's only 53 or so by ANH. Unless he REALLY let himself go, he's not old enough to be as lame a fighter as he was in ANH. None of your responses addressed what I actually said. You just filled in the reply spots with the same stuff you've been saying over and over again. Which just equals some lame manifesto about your personal opinion of the ST and your criticism of OT fans. I'm not going to respond anymore till you start talking to me and not talking at me. I don't have time to talk to clowns who are looking for an excuse to post their same manifesto 4 dozen times a day. Yawn...
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ryboto
Sophomore
@ryboto
Posts: 776
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Post by ryboto on Apr 2, 2018 13:15:25 GMT
who the shit is this loser?
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Apr 2, 2018 13:26:17 GMT
who the shit is this loser? LOL, formersam...? He is essentially a more civilized version of weirdraptor, if you remember that Brony-Marvel nutjob, or MCU fan. Formersam is a Marveltard you know those guys who believe the MCU movies are the greatest juvenile achievement of all time, and spend their life in the basement bullying and trolling other franchises, preferably X-Men, Spiderman and of course DC to no end on how much more money MCU makes. Moto for movies: The sillier and more formulaic the better, including Star Wars.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 2, 2018 13:47:35 GMT
who the shit is this loser? Someone who doesn't hate the ST for existing.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 2, 2018 13:48:37 GMT
who the shit is this loser? who believe the MCU movies are the greatest film achievement of all time, Nah, just after suffering through all the prior CBMs that were ashamed of the source material it was nice to get something unashamed.
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Apr 2, 2018 13:57:22 GMT
who believe the MCU movies are the greatest film achievement of all time, Nah, just after suffering through all the prior CBMs that were ashamed of the source material it was nice to get something unashamed. lol, yeah, like NOLAN's Dark Knight, or Burton's Batman or Donner's Superman, or even Fox's awesome X-Men, all ashamed of the source material like MCU turning Ragnarök-myth into Fragglerock and Thor into a comedian crying when getting an haircut. That aside, while this SW forum is not your comic book comfort zone thematically, it must be your wet dream battling hoards of deeply ashamed Disney-traitors and infidels. In the words of one of the best CBM ever: You are the Gadfly this forum needs, not the one it deserves!
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