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Post by thorshairspray on Mar 23, 2017 17:50:09 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2017 18:12:33 GMT
Here's the BBC's report on the conviction: No other national news outlets are covering this story. I wonder why that is? Could something missing from the BBC article but which is in the Huddersfield local article hold the answer: |
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Post by cupcakes on Mar 24, 2017 16:27:46 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2017 17:13:17 GMT
This isn't the first pedophile ring that involved Muslims preying on white girls: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandalwww.halifaxcourier.co.uk/news/crime/child-sexual-abuse-ring-in-halifax-25-men-charged-police-reaction-1-7096362en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rochdale_child_sex_abuse_ringen.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derby_child_sex_abuse_ringIn at least two of those cases (Rotherham and Derby) it was found after investigations that the reason why authorities were reluctant to investigate is because the perpetrator's were all Muslim's and they didn't want to be accused of racism. There is a serious problem within the Muslim Asian community when it comes to the sexual abuse of young girls(mainly white). Of course some people have already noted it: Take this article from the independent newspaper: Child sex grooming: the Asian question
Various newspapers have quoted figures complied by The Times which examined the 18 trials mentioned earlier and showed that of the 56 people found guilty of crimes including rape, child abduction, indecent assault and sex with a child, 53 were Asian. Of those, 50 were Muslim and a majority were members of the British Pakistani community. Most of the victims have been white, although in one case several Bangladeshi Muslim girls were also abused. These were reported as being supported by research by two academics at the Jill Dando Institute of Security and Crime Science at University College London (UCL) which examined just two cases, involving 25 offenders.
However, the picture presented by the academics, Ella Cockbain and Helen Brayley, is a lot less clear. "The citations are correct but they have been taken out of context," says Ms Cockbain. "Nor do they acknowledge the small sample size of the original research, which focused on just two large cases." They worried that "findings were being overextended from a small, geographically concentrated sample to characterise an entire crime type". Even their most recent work studies just five cases – though of the 52 offenders involved totals 83 per cent are Asian Pakistani, 11 per cent Asian other and 6 per cent white. That is a very small sample.
So is this a particular problem in the British Asian community? The question touches on so many sensitivities about race in contemporary society that it is hard to find anyone prepared to tackle it clearly and sensibly. Perhaps that is not surprising. When the former Home Secretary Jack Straw raised the issue last year – claiming that "there is a specific problem which involves Pakistani heritage men... who target vulnerable young white girls" seeing them as "easy meat" for sexual abuse – he found himself in political trouble. He was criticised by one fellow MP for "stereotyping a whole community".
Something similar has happened to a support group called Crop (the Coalition for the Removal of Pimping), for the parents of sexually exploited girls. Since 2002 the group, which is based in Leeds, has supported the families of 400 victims, including that of Emma Jackson. Last year it was saying that the families had suffered mainly at the hands of Pakistani men.
"The vast majority are white families and the perpetrators are Pakistani Asians," the organisation's chair of trustees, Hilary Willmer, was quoted as saying. Sources inside Crop placed the percentage as high as 80 per cent, although Kurdish, Romanian and Albanian gangs were also involved.
But today Crop has become nervous about making public statements on the racial dimension of the abuse. "We've been accused of being a cover for the BNP," Ms Willmer told The Independent.
The girls whose families Crop tries to help aretypically targeted between the ages of 11 and 15. Accounts of their experiences still fill the organisation's website. Story after story shows how subtly and insidiously the grooming is done. Crop believes, based on limited reporting data, that as many as 10,000 children in the UK may be victims of sexual exploitation. But on the cultural background of the predators, Crop has gone suddenly silent. So too have the police.
Lancashire Police are so nervous about the subject that they would not even talk about a pilot project which is considered the national model for how to deal with the grooming of unsuspecting children. Called Engage, and based in Jack Straw's Blackburn constituency, it brings together a range of services – police, social workers, nurses, sexual health and drugs workers and Crop parents – to prevent, protect and prosecute.
The project carries out surveillance operations against men suspected of exploiting children sexually. It also issues legal warning notices to suspect adults and tours secondary schools with its own film, aimed at young teenaged girls and warning them – as Emma Jackson puts it – about the dangers they face "when they are 13 and so naïve and trusting about what can happen".
In the four years since it was formed Engage has rescued 80 children from sexual exploitation and got many back into school. It has had a conviction rate of 90 per cent. Working in the Eastern Division, which had the highest figures for missing children – and where only one offender had previously been convicted – the project uncovered, in 2008-2009 alone, a total of 100 offences of child abduction, rape and sexual activity with minors involving 36 individuals.
Strangely, however, Lancashire Police refused several requests over the past two months to talk to The Independent about the success of the project. So too did Nick McPartlan, the team manager at Engage. So did the project's parents' representative. All this hyper-sensitivity has led to accusations of political correctness from right-wing newspapers, whose anti-immigration agenda is neatly fed by suggestions that on-street grooming is a peculiarly Asian phenomenon.
"Police and social services have been accused of fuelling a culture of silence which has allowed hundreds of young white girls to be exploited by Asian men for sex," the Daily Mail has said. "Experts claim the statistics represent a mere fraction of a 'tidal wave' of offending in counties across the Midlands and the north of England which has been going on for more than a decade." It reported that one senior policeman, Detective Chief Inspector Alan Edwards of West Mercia Police, had called for "an end to the 'damaging taboo' connecting on-street grooming with race", quoting him as saying that "these girls are being passed around and used as meat".
The response of the Government was for the Children's minister, Tim Loughton, to warn that that "denial" over racial grooming did nothing to help victims.
"Political correctness and racial sensitivities have in the past been an issue," he said, and the authorities still "have to be aware of certain characteristics of various ethnic communities and be sensitive as to how we deal with them." All cases must be vigorously investigated, he insisted, though he added that grooming underage children for sex was not a problem exclusively associated with one particular community. So: what are those "certain characteristics of various ethnic communities"? And where does the truth lie?
Last year, the government's Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre launched a five-month investigation into the issue. It took the broadest definition of underage grooming, describing it as any situation where a child or young person receives something in exchange for performing sexual favours.
The centre identified 2,379 potential offenders who had been reported for grooming since 2008. The vast majority were men. Most were aged 18 to 24. It could fully identify only 940 of the suspects. Of these, 38 per cent were white, 32 per cent were recorded as of unknown ethnicity, 26 per cent were Asian, 3 per cent were black and less than 1 per cent were Chinese.
These figures were reported in the media with various degrees of sensationalism. The 2001 census recorded 92.1 per cent of the general population as white, 2 per cent as black, 3.1 per cent as Indian or Pakistani, 1.2 per cent as "mixed" and 1.6 per cent as "other". But what was not prominently noted was that the centre's findings were heavily qualified by phrases such as "where ethnicity was recorded". What about the cases where it was not? The overall data was poorly recorded, inconsistent and incomplete, expert academics say.
"[The centre] drew data from a whole range of groups, like the children’s charity Barnardo’s, and as a result all the figures compiled have to be treated with caution as they were not all compiled in the same way," say Ella Cockbain and Helen Brayley from UCL. "There is no criminal offence of 'on-street grooming'. Consequently, it is very difficult to measure the extent of this crime based on court statistics," they say.
But the Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre deliberately refrained from drawing conclusions about ethnicity, admitting itself that the data was "too inconsistent". "Focusing on this problem simply through the lens of ethnicity does not do it service," said its chief executive, Peter Davies. The organisation has passed the buck on this delicate issue to the government's Office of the Children's Commissioner, which is nine months into a two-year inquiry into child sexual exploitation by street gangs.
Until that inquiry reports, those who are reluctant to rush to racial stereotyping may, as Ella Cockbain puts it, "not be involved in a culture of silence so much as a culture of caution".So I live in a country where Muslims are raping white girls at a rate that's 8 times higher than most other ethnic groups,I've got people scared to broadcast this fact for fear of being labelled racist. So definitely not all Muslims but certainly I sizable and worrying minority. With the terrorist attack yesterday it's long overdue that the gloves come of when it comes to Islam,because some hard questions need to be asked about how it treats non-Muslims, it's attitudes towards criticism and tolerance of others. I am.fucking sick to death of people trying to do everything they can to stop us asking these questions,by shutting down the debate with cries of racist. |
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Post by phludowin on Mar 24, 2017 17:19:30 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2017 17:27:11 GMT
That wasn't their yesterday when I looked. Care to explain why as with the BBC report none of the men were named or was it mentioned that they are all British Asian men? Making Huddersfield the 18th pedophile ring involving 98% British Asian men to be prosecuted in the last 5 years. Edit: Oh and although ITV is a national news organisation Calender is a regional news programme that only covers Yorkshire,so not national at all. |
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Post by cupcakes on Mar 24, 2017 17:40:56 GMT
tpfkar I'm sick of people barking reams of sh!t that fail to make their case that a whole class of people should be condemned by the miscreants in the group, followed up by howls of "shutting down the debate" when their chanted tarring bullying attempts are objected to.  sh!t's everywhere |
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Post by phludowin on Mar 24, 2017 17:52:16 GMT
Care to explain why as with the BBC report none of the men were named or was it mentioned that they are all British Asian men?There were also 2 women, according to the reports. People are still making stuff up. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2017 18:20:00 GMT
tpfkar I'm sick of people barking reams of sh!t that fail to make their case that a whole class of people should be condemned by the miscreants in the group, followed up by howls of "shutting down the debate" when their chanted tarring bullying attempts are objected to. sh!t's everywhereThe miscreants of the group? So when a judge in one of those cases sums up with these words: So because it's not a 100% of Muslims committing these crimes I somehow can't make the causal link that how the Qu'ran instructs Muslims to view non-believers and women wasn't a factor in these abuse gangs actions? Ok then let's talk British Muslims and their opinions. In 2016 Channel 4 a left wing broadcaster commissioned ICM to do the most in depth and extensive poll of British Muslims ever conducting,to say the results were shocking is something of an understatement. This gives you a snapshot of what the average Muslim in the street really thinks: www.icmunlimited.com/polls/icm-muslims-survey-for-channel-4/Here's the highlights: So over half of British Muslims want homosexuality to be illegal,nearly half wouldn't want gays to be teachers 1 in 4 Muslims would like to live under Sharia law. 2 out of every 5 Muslims believe wives should obey their husbands. So it is my contention that those views are largely incompatible with British secular western values. And those opinions stem from Islam and the Qu'ran itself. I don't want fascistic homophobic bigots who think like that in my country and I certainly don't want to bring anymore in. Do you think I'm some type of knuckle dragging racist who arrived at these opinions in a vacuum? I live in Manchester which has a large Muslim population,I have interacted with Muslims all my life. And just to give you an example of why I'm concerned: www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/london-attack-manchester-live-arrest-12790091The man arrested in connection with yesterdays London terror attacks lived 400 metres from my house. So to me the threat isn't abstract but very real. |
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Post by thorshairspray on Mar 24, 2017 18:27:45 GMT
tpfkar I'm sick of people barking reams of sh!t that fail to make their case that a whole class of people should be condemned by the miscreants in the group, followed up by howls of "shutting down the debate" when their chanted tarring bullying attempts are objected to. sh!t's everywhereNobody is suggesting that. But can you honestly say that there isn't a problem specific to the British Islamic community here? The number of Asian men involved in child sex offenses is way higher per capita than white men. |
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Post by blade on Mar 24, 2017 18:29:35 GMT
tpfkar I'm sick of people barking reams of sh!t that fail to make their case that a whole class of people should be condemned by the miscreants in the group, followed up by howls of "shutting down the debate" when their chanted tarring bullying attempts are objected to. sh!t's everywhereThe miscreants of the group? So when a judge in one of those cases sums up with these words: So because it's not a 100% of Muslims committing these crimes I somehow can't make the causal link that how the Qu'ran instructs Muslims to view non-believers and women wasn't a factor in these abuse gangs actions? Ok then let's talk British Muslims and their opinions. In 2016 Channel 4 a left wing broadcaster commissioned ICM to do the most in depth and extensive poll of British Muslims ever conducting,to say the results were shocking is something of an understatement. This gives you a snapshot of what the average Muslim in the street really thinks: www.icmunlimited.com/polls/icm-muslims-survey-for-channel-4/Here's the highlights: So over half of British Muslims want homosexuality to be illegal,nearly half wouldn't want gays to be teachers 1 in 4 Muslims would like to live under Sharia law. 2 out of every 5 Muslims believe wives should obey their husbands. So it is my contention that those views are largely incompatible with British secular western values. And those opinions stem from Islam and the Qu'ran itself. I don't want fascistic homophobic bigots who think like that in my country and I certainly don't want to bring anymore in. Do you think I'm some type of knuckle dragging racist who arrived at these opinions in a vacuum? I live in Manchester which has a large Muslim population,I have interacted with Muslims all my life. And just to give you an example of why I'm concerned: www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/london-attack-manchester-live-arrest-12790091The man arrested in connection with yesterdays London terror attacks lived 400 metres from my house. So to me the threat isn't abstract but very real. Have you made any death threats today SuperCreepyDude? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2017 18:36:08 GMT
Care to explain why as with the BBC report none of the men were named or was it mentioned that they are all British Asian men?There were also 2 women, according to the reports. People are still making stuff up. Indeed there were two women. Here are their names: I wonder what ethnic background they're from? They were also charged with child neglect not sexual offences which is why I didn't include them So I should have said "Asian men and women". Care to address the statistics I gave or would you like to continue to obfuscate? |
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Post by PanLeo on Mar 24, 2017 18:48:30 GMT
Nobody is claiming this is cultural enrichment.
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Post by thorshairspray on Mar 24, 2017 20:03:19 GMT
Nobody is claiming this is cultural enrichment. Come on, you're not American, you understand sarcasm. |
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Post by cupcakes on Mar 25, 2017 0:59:48 GMT
tpfkar Sure, the miscreants of any group. And "cultural issues" can be involved in any case, and does not == "being Muslim". I'm all for screening potential immigrants based on attitude toward secular values. But that would filter out a lot more than just a bunch of Muslims. And should also include those predisposed to condemnation of wide groups of "the other" based on the actions of some of them, or pretending that disagreeing with and analyzing what's presented is "shutting down the debate with cries of racist". Huddersfield |
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Post by cupcakes on Mar 25, 2017 1:05:00 GMT
I suppose you should read the post it was in response to again. everywhere |
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Post by thorshairspray on Mar 25, 2017 1:17:04 GMT
I suppose you should read the post it was in response to again. everywhereI did. Nobody is suggesting what you claim. But you demonstrate the problem. The stats posted by Supes are true. All polls show British Muslim are socially regressive. The crimes stats show Muslim men are massively overrepresented in sex offences and child sex offences. There is a problem in that community whether you like it or not. But when anyone brings it up, we get people crying "racism" and "islamophobia" Look, the majority of child sex offences are committed by men, about 80% are you going to call "misandrry" if we seek to know why? But if I point out the majority of violence against children is committed by women, I bet that will make you uncomfortable. |
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Post by cupcakes on Mar 25, 2017 1:32:21 GMT
tpfkar In fact they are in this very thread. In fact I think the paint-em-all based on some is the problem. I don't trust your stats as I know where they're coming from and how they're presented. And even if "Asians" or "Muslims" are overrepresented in actual crimes that doesn't change a bit of what I've posted. Seems like you guys are the ones howling "racism" and "Islamophobia". Regardless of your "seek to know why", a certain group that happen to be Asian Muslims does not yield broad general conclusions about "Muslims" and "Asians". None of that stops anybody from pursuing any hard evidence and the roots of any particular problem, be it a group of criminals or dereliction of duty. And I don't give a flying crap what you bet. I mean everywhere |
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Post by thorshairspray on Mar 25, 2017 1:44:50 GMT
tpfkar In fact they are in this very thread. In fact I think the paint-em-all based on some is the problem. I don't trust your stats as I know where they're coming from and how they're presented. And even if "Asians" or "Muslims" are overrepresented in actual crimes that doesn't change a bit of what I've posted. Seems like you guys are the ones howling "racism" and "Islamophobia". Regardless of your "seek to know why", a certain group that happen to be Asian Muslims does not yield broad general conclusions about "Muslims" and "Asians". None of that stops anybody from pursuing any hard evidence and the roots of any particular problem, be it a group of criminals or dereliction of duty. And I don't give a flying crap what you bet. I mean everywhereWell in fact, they aren't. And if you think crying "racism" doesn't stop people investigating crime, see Rotherham. |
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Post by cupcakes on Mar 25, 2017 2:06:26 GMT
 See "dereliction of duty". Nobody's arguing that crimes shouldn't be thoroughly investigated or that criminals shouldn't bear the full weight of the law. Once somebody starts generalizing into "Asians" and "Muslims" it's a whole different matter. How I view dogs |
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