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Post by Isapop on Feb 8, 2019 17:22:08 GMT
doesn't alter God's decision to have Adam's unborn ancestors inherit and suffer for it.
others have been pointing out to you that the entire Bible is the story of how God undoes that thing that your bitching about You must also fall for it when Trump takes credit for solving a problem that HE created.
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Post by Vegas on Feb 8, 2019 17:47:32 GMT
others have been pointing out to you that the entire Bible is the story of how God undoes that thing that your bitching about You must also fall for it when Trump takes credit for solving a problem that HE created. *sigh* Solving a problem doesn't mean that you are "taking credit" for solving it. Technically..... He didn't create the problem.. He just created the rules that were broken by others. Here's the problem: You're just a whiney asshole. If God just bullied His solution by just enacting his solution immediately.. You'd be whining - just like you are now - about how God is a tyrant and didn't answer any of the issues raised in The Garden and calling Him a hypocrite. - "God didn't give Man a chance to live without Him to see if we're better off without having God in our universe... He just changed His rules to enforce His will on humanity. What's God so afraid of?" You bitch just to bitch... No solution is a solution to you... That's what makes you an asshole. You'll never be happy.. You'll just always whine. Put those together.. and you're just a whiney asshole.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Feb 8, 2019 17:54:49 GMT
Which begs the question, why would one worship such a god? i didn’t say anything about a sin gene.
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Feb 8, 2019 18:12:04 GMT
No one's answered this question yet, other than with deflection:
God's decision to have Adam's unborn ancestors inherit and suffer for it.
Why would anyone worship that god?
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Post by Vegas on Feb 8, 2019 18:23:09 GMT
No one's answered this question yet, other than with deflection: God's decision to have Adam's unborn ancestors inherit and suffer for it.Why would anyone worship that god? Because some people understand the story... comprehend His motivation... and look beyond their own lives to a better future. Is that enough of an answer... or do you plan on still saying that no one has answered the question?
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Feb 8, 2019 18:36:39 GMT
No one's answered this question yet, other than with deflection: God's decision to have Adam's unborn ancestors inherit and suffer for it.Why would anyone worship that god? Because some people understand the story... comprehend His motivation... and look beyond their own lives to a better future. Is that enough of an answer... or do you plan on still saying that no one has answered the question? My post was aimed at cooljgs, who deflected with a statement about another question. But, to answer yours, no, that is not enough of an answer, because to an atheist like myself, we see no god, no motivation, and his followers aren't exactly shining examples of goodness. A few, maybe, but overall, most - no. We enter church and have to say, "We have erred and strayed from Thy ways like lost sheep," when what we want to say is, "Why are we made to err and stray like lost sheep?" Thomas Hardy, English writer and poet, 1840-1928.
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Post by Vegas on Feb 8, 2019 18:50:58 GMT
Because some people understand the story... comprehend His motivation... and look beyond their own lives to a better future. Is that enough of an answer... or do you plan on still saying that no one has answered the question? My post was aimed at cooljgs, who deflected with a statement about another question. But, to answer yours, no, that is not enough of an answer, because to an atheist like myself, we see no god, no motivation, and his followers aren't exactly shining examples of goodness. A few, maybe, but overall, most - no. I see no God as well... however... I also see no Harry Potter.. but, that doesn't stop me from reading a book and understanding him. Understanding something... or even understanding that others understand something... doesn't mean that you agree with that thing or believe it as real.
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Post by Isapop on Feb 8, 2019 18:51:46 GMT
You must also fall for it when Trump takes credit for solving a problem that HE created. *sigh* Solving a problem doesn't mean that you are "taking credit" for solving it. Technically..... He didn't create the problem.. He just created the rules that were broken by others. Here's the problem: You're just a whiney asshole. If God just bullied His solution by just enacting his solution immediately.. You'd be whining - just like you are now - about how God is a tyrant and didn't answer any of the issues raised in The Garden and calling Him a hypocrite. - "God didn't give Man a chance to live without Him to see if we're better off without having God in our universe... He just changed His rules to enforce His will on humanity. What's God so afraid of?" You bitch just to bitch... No solution is a solution to you... That's what makes you an asshole. You'll never be happy.. You'll just always whine. Put those together.. and you're just a whiney asshole. Wow! In your devastating cascade of taunts (Gracious me! How will I ever recover?) is there somewhere an answer to what I said? Let's see. I said, "You must also fall for it when Trump takes credit for solving a problem that HE created." Oh, here it is! Could you be any lamer if you tried? Obviously, what I said has nothing at all to do with whether somebody takes credit for solving a problem, but everything to do with the one solving the problem being the very one who also CREATED the problem. (Try to keep up, will you?) You're still not keeping up. This is not at all about Adam breaking God's rule and being punished for it, which God warned Adam about. This is about God deciding that Adam's unborn children must also be punished for it (which is, btw, a punishment that God didn't warn Adam about).
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Feb 8, 2019 19:08:38 GMT
My post was aimed at cooljgs, who deflected with a statement about another question. But, to answer yours, no, that is not enough of an answer, because to an atheist like myself, we see no god, no motivation, and his followers aren't exactly shining examples of goodness. A few, maybe, but overall, most - no. I see no God as well... however... I also see no Harry Potter.. but, that doesn't stop me from reading a book and understanding him. Understanding something... or even understanding that others understand something... doesn't mean that you agree with that thing or believe it as real.True, technically, but don't you wonder why people claim to 'understand' something that does not exist? What I understand is that humans have formed religion, not just Christianity, over our own history, because in part it is what the believers want to believe. It's a (false) certainty in an uncertain world. It is also a genetic trait - we carry the genes of the ones who ran. We are genetically programmed to believe in life forces that we cannot see, paraphrasing Gil Grissom, from one of my past posts. Edit: I went back and found the original post... and the quote...
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Post by Vegas on Feb 8, 2019 19:11:31 GMT
Isapop You brought up "taking credit".. and "falling for it". It's nice to see that your even stupid about you being stupid. You quote the answer to the difference in the very next sentence... You can't even keep up when we're standing still. I did a thread questioning this oversight in the story yeaaaars ago on the old board.. Yes. God doesn't mention kids outright in the warning... Seems like a detail that should be mentioned.. But.. It doesn't change the fact that Adam losing his "perfect" status means that he could no longer give birth to people with "perfect" status. It is just a "it is". Maybe God could have created more "perfect" people... but, He let this story unfold the way it did... because there were other issues raised in The Garden Of Eden. The Bible's whole story is God undoing all of this while answering those questions. 2,675!!!
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Post by goz on Feb 8, 2019 21:04:19 GMT
No, what a stupid suggestion. Ask Vegas what constitutes the dent. I did and he had no answer except 'imperfections'. Since evolution works with imperfections ( mutations) it wasn't especially helpful. ok I’m just explaining my view that universal human traits can be carried on indefinitely. OBVIOUSLY it depends how you categorise a trait. ANYWAY they all depend on evolution and the laws of human genetics, so what exactly is your point apart from the facts that humans universally have two eyes?
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Post by Vegas on Feb 9, 2019 5:26:52 GMT
Of course you think that.... You're a fucking idiot. I am not the one with tourettes. No.. You're the one with chronic halitosis... a single digit IQ number... an extra chromosome... half a brain... a desperate need for my attention...
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Post by Vegas on Feb 9, 2019 5:46:57 GMT
No.. You're the one with chronic halitosis... a single digit IQ number... an extra chromosome... half a brain... a desperate need for my attention...
No-one actively seeks your attention, only to ridicule the rubbish you post.
He writes as he actively seeks my attention.....
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Post by goz on Feb 9, 2019 5:51:28 GMT
No-one actively seeks your attention, only to ridicule the rubbish you post.
He writes as he actively seeks my attention..... Get a room, you two !
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Post by Vegas on Feb 9, 2019 5:52:47 GMT
He writes as he actively seeks my attention..... Get a room, you two !
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Post by rizdek on Feb 10, 2019 1:34:26 GMT
You did? Well, then, you suck at asking questions... but, I suck at answering them.. so.. we're even. I will point out that even "imperfections (mutations)" are just facets of the greater imperfection that makes humans the way were are.. as opposed to the way that The Bible says that we're supposed to be. According to The Bible, genetic "perfection" comes with benefits such as never getting sick and, apparently, not dying. So the imperfection being discussed (the dent) is whatever it was that changed us to being fucked up mortals that, even after a life of doing good deeds, will grow old, sick, and die... ....and would allow for those mutations. Flawed mortal humans will always give birth to flawed mortal humans... and that has always been the case.. even 6 generations ago. I guess then, that Hitler thought he had the right idea and was on his way to finding God's perfection, with his notion of the superior race.
Here's a Superior race...or is it improper to joke of such things?
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Feb 10, 2019 1:42:22 GMT
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Post by Vegas on Feb 10, 2019 15:27:40 GMT
To suggest I get a room with that chimp, makes me feel more nauseous than you.... He writes as he masturbates.....
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Post by gadreel on Feb 10, 2019 18:02:29 GMT
Then it was not perfect. unless you are saying it is perfectly circular but it's other elements are not perfect an so can be changed and maintain the stated perfection, but the statement in this context was that the circle was perfect, if is was perfect as a green circle, how can it be perfect as a red circle? I looked up the definition of "perfect". The first two I found were "without flaws" and "satisfying all requirements". So if the requirements for a perfect circle were: "border without bumps" and "only one color", then both a smooth red circle of 2 cm diameter and a smooth green circle of 3 cm diameter would be perfect. If for the definition of a perfect circle there also was: Completely black, and exactly 1 cm diameter, then neither circle I described would be perfect. Basically, there is no absolute perfection. As people say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Same for perfection. Yes I think the issue is the definition of perfect, it's a hard one in religion as it is wholistic, Adam was perfect, without qualification, if everything about something is without flaw (which is how I would interpret that ) then anything that was changed would become flawed in my opinion, but I concede that Adam could be perfect in some ways but not in others, although that seems to defeat the purpose of the story.
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Post by gadreel on Feb 10, 2019 18:06:13 GMT
Then it was not perfect. unless you are saying it is perfectly circular but it's other elements are not perfect an so can be changed and maintain the stated perfection, but the statement in this context was that the circle was perfect, if is was perfect as a green circle, how can it be perfect as a red circle? You're making the assumption there is only one state of perfection, and that any change from perfection necessarily moves away from it. But I see nothing in common definitions of the word to justify this stance. We've both agreed in this thread that the concept of perfection is problematic, but if we're making the assumption that perfection is a sensible concept, and that a state of perfection is possible, it's reasonable to assume there are more than one of them. Hmm, I have issues with that, whenever we use perfect in conversation, changing the element that is perfect moves the object away from that perfection, a screwdriver that perfectly fits a screw no longer is perfect in that way if it is changed to no longer fit the screw, if something is described as perfect without any qualification I read that as 'fits every thing perfectly in every way' if any element is changed it will no longer fit perfectly and so has moved away from perfection. But as you say it is problematic.
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