POLL - "Rogue One" vs. "The Force Awakens" ?
Jun 15, 2017 20:07:20 GMT
coldenhaulfield and Tristan's Journal like this
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2017 20:07:20 GMT
In typical TFA apologist fashion you're stretching generalized and conceptual rehash in other SW films to try and be the same thing as the more exacting "cloned" rehash of TFA.
I'm going to go over these rehash lists of Tristan's Journal and moviebuffbrad and put my notes of commentary in bold.
I didn't even get into the stuff TPM cribbed from ROTJ, so much so that fans have developed a "Ring Theory" to explain the similarities. How about the good guys in TPM enlisting the help of annoying native creatures to battle? A father/father figure dying in a young Jedi's arms after the villain takes a trip down a shaft?
The openings with a ship docking,
This is *extremely* generalized. The ships are nothing alike. The scenes are nothing alike. The purpose is nothing alike... This is exactly what I'm talking about by stretching and reaching with vague generalization that are made to be fairly compared with cloning level rehash in TFA.
the middles with high speed ground vehicle set pieces (speeder chase/podrace),
Okay that's a big correlation. But one is a race and another is a chase. They were different in purpose and different environments so... still not quite the clone level rehash found in most of TFA.
and the climaxes with the interconnected lightsaber duels/ground battles/space battles?
Okay those climaxes are probably unique from a plot, strategy, and sequence standpoint to those 2 films (TPM, ROTJ).
I don't see the correlation between Fett and Phasma myself, aside from "they both wear costumes".
I explained the correlation in a point above. There's definitely more correlation than "both wear costumes".
I also watched the video, and don't entirely disagree with anything stated, but do you think TPM would pass the test if Lucas wasn't involved?
If it was cinematically made the same way, yes.
Video guy also brought up something I was gonna talk about: Finn. By your guys' admission, Finn and his storyline don't really compare to anything we've seen before.
It's a fair point. But Finn is still not entirely new. Yes his concept is new. But his characterization isn't. Not much of it is devoted to a persona of a rogue Stormtrooper who develops a heightened conscience. He spends much time playing the role of a doormat sidekick who fulfilled the humor parts that C3PO and Luke Skywalker did in ANH. But he with more of a Jar Jar Binks type of delivery.
What new character or storyline does TPM really bring to the table?
Qui-Gon - Ben Kenobi
Anakin/Obi-Wan - Luke
ObiWan really doesn't compare to Luke in this movie. That's a desperate generalization just because he was an apprentice. This is new because this is the first time we see the nature of a master/apprentice relationship under the guise of the Jedi code and the Jedi Order.
Padme - Leia
Palpatine - himself
Another desperate generalization. We never seen Palpatine as Palpatine, not Sidious. We had never seen the nature and persona before. This was new.
Maul - Vader
There's absolutely no correlation between Vader and Maul other than they were both apprentices of Sidious and they both wore black.
Nute Gunroy - Tarkin
That's a very vague rehash of Tarkin! They look nothing alike. They don't work for the same organizations and don't have the same organizational relationships with their Sith Lord boss. They don't specifically have the same goals. He's a space station commander... and later on in the movie he does team up with the Sith apprentice in strategy. That's about it.
Jar Jar - Wicket
Shmi - Aunt Beru
Watto - Jabba
Naboo - Alderan
That's a horrible stretch! There's absolutely no correlation between the 2. None! 😂 Lol
Coruscant - Los Angeles 2019 (wait, wrong Harrison Ford franchise)
Yeah. Laughably desperate!
And thanks, but I took a fallacy class and had those points removed. As for everyone laughing at my sad devotion to The Force Awakens,
Well the thing is... (and I'm really not saying this to be condescending)... as is typical of the hundreds of threads I've seen trying to make TFA rehash seem like normal SW rehash, and other SW rehash seem like it's equal to TFA... most of your examples are stretches and quite a few are laughably bad. (Hence "everyone laughing").
the thing is, I don't even like it that much. I gave it a 7. I just don't think despising it for rehashing things and giving ROTJ and especially TPM a pass is very fair.
This'n was da reaction of many SW fans to TFA whom were not rehash addicts:
"Well shut me down! ANH making TFA!?! How perverse!"
"This is just a Disney princess nightmare!! I want to go home!!"