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Post by rachelcarson1953 on May 1, 2017 15:07:27 GMT
For the record, "Under God" wasn't actually added until 1954 to stick it to those Godless commies. Can they make it optional? That way everyone will be happy. At the present it seems as if the people who don't believe in god thingy are forced to say that. I personally won't complain as I can say things without believing in them but some people may feel otherwise. It is supposed to be optional.
The First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America:
The first ten Amendments (Bill of Rights) were ratified effective December 15, 1791.
Edit: And the above was hand-typed into this post from my little hardbound copy of The Constitution that I bought on the sale rack at Barnes and Noble for a mere $1.00.
All the First Amendment does, as far as religion is concerned, is to keep the government out of it so each individual is free to choose how and what to believe.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 1, 2017 15:10:26 GMT
You would need to ask IslandMur.
I was only helping lowtax get the point of her statement.
I voted for the pledge to be abolished altogether and my response was pretty clear in my first comment.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 1, 2017 15:12:03 GMT
For the record, "Under God" wasn't actually added until 1954 to stick it to those Godless commies. Can they make it optional? That way everyone will be happy. At the present it seems as if the people who don't believe in god thingy are forced to say that. I personally won't complain as I can say things without believing in them but some people may feel otherwise. It's completely optional.
No one is forced to pledge allegiance to the flag meaning they are not obligate to recite under god.
I haven't pledge allegiance to it in 20 years at least. You just get funny looks, but probably not because of the god part.
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 15:15:30 GMT
tpfkar Help CoolJGS to the point of your "vindictiveness". I never said anything other than it being an insult. That's why only the worst atheists, defined by their disdain for religion and religious folk, got the label.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 1, 2017 15:20:08 GMT
tpfkar Help CoolJGS to the point of your "vindictiveness". I never said anything other than it being an insult. That's why only the worst atheists, defined by their disdain for religion and religious folk, got the label.Do I need it? I didn't know I cared that much.
What else concerns me?
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 15:25:38 GMT
tpfkar Whatever other rambles you feel like frolicking off to, I was asking you what vindictiveness you were suggesting. But if you don't know your own mind I suppose that clarifies something. So you are a heathen. It doesn;t matter if I use it to insult you or just as the accurate term to describe you. Deal with it.
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islandmur
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All religions have messages of peace and love yet all religions are used for wars and hatred...
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Post by islandmur on May 1, 2017 16:06:10 GMT
You would need to ask IslandMur.
I was only helping lowtax get the point of her statement.
I voted for the pledge to be abolished altogether and my response was pretty clear in my first comment.
Well sometimes it seems to me both side say or do things just to be petty. I think removing under god is one of those things, because it's not harmful or anything. I think that christians using religion to deny services such as the pill to customers is petty. While i'm not an Atheist I'm also not a Religious person, my beliefs lie along a different path.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 1, 2017 16:18:27 GMT
tpfkar Whatever other rambles you feel like frolicking off to, I was asking you what vindictiveness you were suggesting. But if you don't know your own mind I suppose that clarifies something. So you are a heathen. It doesn;t matter if I use it to insult you or just as the accurate term to describe you. Deal with it.It was asked and answered, but feel free to pick pointless fights for all eternity!
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 1, 2017 16:25:39 GMT
islandmurI think it depends on context. Many times, it is not a issue of pettiness. If a religious organization is allowed t run a healthcare facility at all, it should be assumed it will be run under the tenets of their beliefs. There should never be a time people should expect a Catholic organization to administer BC pills and if the issue is forced, then they should close them down and figure out a secular way to fill their shoes. on the other hand if someone is refusing because they are Christian but nothing in the tenets f their church practice that (Like Baptist who refuse BC pills), then it's probably more a personal issue and thus petty.
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 16:29:41 GMT
tpfkar Not by you, other than your constant evasion, but feel free to find something to moan about for all eternity. However, this word is no big deal. It took me forever to find it after being chastised for using the h-word.
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 16:33:13 GMT
tpfkar It's not petty to hold to a principle, especially when wide swathes of the population take the wrong idea from a practice. Otherwise it would just be ceremonial leftovers. But given the makeup of our country, it definitely should go, the only question is when. Nothing petty or vindictive about that position. E pluribus unum
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islandmur
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All religions have messages of peace and love yet all religions are used for wars and hatred...
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Post by islandmur on May 1, 2017 16:43:43 GMT
tpfkar It's not petty to hold to a principle, especially when wide swathes of the population take the wrong idea from a practice. Otherwise it would just be ceremonial leftovers. But given the makeup of our country, it definitely should go, the only question is when. Nothing petty or vindictive about that position. E pluribus unumIt is petty if you are working in a non religious facility and the person buying is not religious. If principles mattered so much to you (the seller) than you should not work in a facility that sold things that were against your beliefs to begin with. So if you can set aside your principle to work in a pharmacy, you can set them aside to sell to those who ask. Anything else is hypocrisy. If you work in a religious pharmacy I'm assuming the question is mooth because they woudln't be selling contraceptive to begin with and I have no problems with that.
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 16:55:16 GMT
tpfkar It's not petty to want to remove slogans pushed through in war and warlike times, concerning an area that government has no business promoting, that are not meaningful to large chunks of the population except perhaps negatively. I cannot see how a man of any large degree of humorous perception can ever be religious -- unless he purposely shut the eyes of his mind & keep them shut by force.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2017 17:03:51 GMT
Only if America abolishes the people's right to worship.
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 17:25:40 GMT
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islandmur
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All religions have messages of peace and love yet all religions are used for wars and hatred...
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Post by islandmur on May 1, 2017 17:26:37 GMT
tpfkar It's not petty to want to remove slogans pushed through in war and warlike times, concerning an area that government has no business promoting, that are not meaningful to large chunks of the population except perhaps negatively. I cannot see how a man of any large degree of humorous perception can ever be religious -- unless he purposely shut the eyes of his mind & keep them shut by force.It is petty. As it the not saying Merry Christmas, as is rebuking people for saying i'll pray for you... when you get to that level it is petty. You don't like saying under god don't say it. I personnally find the pledge itself to be something you should get rid of, but i won't make a movement out of that. America was founded by religious people it's become less and less relgious over time ... get over it. You have a religious as well as an cultural hisory. Removing statues or sculptures that say this or that is petty! it's your history! Add to it augment it. Under god will dissapear on its own as more and more people stop saying it, there is no need to forcibly remove it... it's not hurting you. And by the way I said petty not Vindictive.
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Post by cupcakes on May 1, 2017 17:44:06 GMT
tpfkar It's not petty, and the religious expecting some kind of reverence for patent claptrap only resoundingly hammers home the point of them needing to be removed. And nobody's talking about abrading text off of old coins. And what a youth recites in a school is not history, it is now. And I'll rebuke any attempt to government-push saying "Merry Christmas". And America was founded by a diverse set of people and based significantly on keeping the promotion of religion out of government. What is petty is calling other people petty and supporting it by attempting to saddle this issue with overused talking points in no way related to the power of government. say Merry Christmas, dammit
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Post by Winston Wolfe on May 1, 2017 20:29:07 GMT
For the record, "Under God" wasn't actually added until 1954 to stick it to those Godless commies. Yes, along with "one nation...indivisible, with liberty and justice for all,"
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Post by MCDemuth on May 1, 2017 20:43:49 GMT
It is petty. As it the not saying Merry Christmas, as is rebuking people for saying i'll pray for you... Yeah... The problem I see with a lot of this "PC" stuff... is not that some things, LIKE: The Pledge Of Allegiance, reference God... It is that people take a personal offence to it and want to "raise hell" over it... When I was in Junior High, my best friend was a Jehovah's Witness. He didn't celebrate Christmas. As a kid, I didn't really know what that meant. (What kid does?). Every Christmas I would still wish him a "Merry Christmas", and he would return the sentiment... WHY? Because He KNEW that I was saying it, because I wanted him to be happy and have a good vacation from school... Not because I was trying to force some religion on him. I'm not religious... But if someone says they will pray for me, I would appreciate their sentiment in caring about me, and just say "Thank You". Shouldn't people see these things from this perspective? By The Way, to all posters here, When you think "Under God", What "Religion" does that promote? God frequently refers to the "Creator" of all things. And there are many religions that have a different creator. Some religions even have more than one. Depending on how you interpret the meaning of a "Creator"... that could also mean your parents, or mother nature, or possibly even Science. Why can't everyone look on the word "God", at least when it comes to the Pledge Of Allegiance", as a general term?
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Post by Arlon10 on May 2, 2017 0:09:37 GMT
tpfkar It wouldn't matter so much except it gives some people the wrong idea about the role of religion in government. In an ideal world, there shouldn't be any governmental promotion of any strain of religion whatsoever. In the current world, it would be political suicide to try to get it removed, and would likely bring even more demagogues to office. freedom fromYou're the one who has the wrong idea about the role of religion in government. Government is not supposed to support religion with money it has collected in taxes. That's all the "separation of church and state" means. Government requires advice from religion on public policy. Why? Science can only solve problems when everyone agrees what the problem is. With most public issues there is no such agreement and science is useless. It now requires politics and or religion to solve the problems.
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