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Post by The Herald Erjen on Feb 28, 2023 23:46:37 GMT
Well, when the state tries to force a church to marry a gay couple, we can both protest it together. In the meantime, I'm not going to oppose what is right simply because of the prospect of some other future wrong. I think Erjen is concerned that it will go a step further and that straight people will be forced into gay marriages No, you think wrong, as usual. Until you mentioned it, that never occurred to me. My concern is that the state will give the churches the choice to perform these obscene marriages or have their 501(c)(3) tax exemption revoked. Under those circumstances, I think most if not all of the churches will comply.
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Post by paulslaugh on Feb 28, 2023 23:59:36 GMT
And you want points for that? Shall we say, "How nice of her! While she WOULD have gay people treated under the law as unequal to straight people, at least she wouldn't have them assaulted or killed!" It's all about one's morals, Isapop . The fact of the matter is, I do not see homosexuality as a correct form of sexuality. While I feel bad for those who are wired with those leanings, I do not support it. Just as I would also never support 2 siblings or even 2 first generation cousins marry either. It certainly is and morals are one’s subjective opinion since there is no means to prove your particular set of morals is the only one. Ethics is how we go in a secular society and our ethic is everyone has equal protection under law, not the unprovable God’s laws. Therefore, if two straight people can get married, so can two gay people since marriage, under the law, is a cohabitation contract, not a religious sacrament.
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Post by paulslaugh on Mar 1, 2023 0:01:50 GMT
Well, when the state tries to force a church to marry a gay couple, we can both protest it together. In the meantime, I'm not going to oppose what is right simply because of the prospect of some other future wrong. I think Erjen is concerned that it will go a step further and that straight people will be forced into gay marriages That’s the “satanic panic” element in the American paranoid style.
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Post by paulslaugh on Mar 1, 2023 0:09:25 GMT
I think Erjen is concerned that it will go a step further and that straight people will be forced into gay marriages No, you think wrong, as usual. Until you mentioned it, that never occurred to me. My concern is that the state will give the churches the choice to perform these obscene marriages or have their 501(c)(3) tax exemption revoked. Under those circumstances, I think most if not all of the churches will comply. That’s not going to happen, panic button, because the Catholic Church technically discriminates against women in their hiring practices. However, when has anyone sued the church the for this? Answer: Never. It would be thrown out of ever court in the country because we have separation of church and state. Religious sacraments are the church’s business. Just how do you think all this liberal dystopia shit will occur? The Courts are skewing very Christian Right friendly now, with SCOTUS decidedly so. And it will be decades before it swings back.
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Post by gadreel on Mar 1, 2023 0:20:12 GMT
I think Erjen is concerned that it will go a step further and that straight people will be forced into gay marriages No, you think wrong, as usual. Until you mentioned it, that never occurred to me. My concern is that the state will give the churches the choice to perform these obscene marriages or have their 501(c)(3) tax exemption revoked. Under those circumstances, I think most if not all of the churches will comply. That has about the same chance of happening as my scenario
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Post by gadreel on Mar 1, 2023 0:21:49 GMT
I think Erjen is concerned that it will go a step further and that straight people will be forced into gay marriages That’s the “satanic panic” element in the American paranoid style. It's crazy huh? I have played D&D since 1983, and the satanic panic was just hilarious, Erjen would be the one ripping up his library card like my grandmother because they let those monsters play that awful game in there, all the while having never once opened up a D&D rulebook. EDIT www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0046and cos the parodies are hilarious www.gamegroup.org/comics/dd.php
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Post by Isapop on Mar 1, 2023 0:26:39 GMT
I think Erjen is concerned that it will go a step further and that straight people will be forced into gay marriages No, you think wrong, as usual. Until you mentioned it, that never occurred to me. My concern is that the state will give the churches the choice to perform these obscene marriages or have their 501(c)(3) tax exemption revoked. Under those circumstances, I think most if not all of the churches will comply. So, in your opinion, most (if not all) churches value the privileged tax status they receive from the state more than they value remaining steadfast in their beliefs.
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Post by clusium on Mar 1, 2023 0:28:13 GMT
What exactly is your question regarding rape culture? Am I for it? Or against it? If that is what you are asking, then the answer is, I am against. Do you understand that rape culture normalises rape, that making it ok to joke about rape makes it more normal and empowers rapists by it's implicit acceptance? Can you tell me why this would be true for rape culture, but that for some reason this does not hold when you normalise demonizing homosexuals? Well, let's put it this way....have you ever seen ME make jokes about rape, etc? I can assure you that I do not tolerate making fun of rape.
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Post by paulslaugh on Mar 1, 2023 0:33:40 GMT
That’s the “satanic panic” element in the American paranoid style. It's crazy huh? I have played D&D since 1983, and the satanic panic was just hilarious, Erjen would be the one ripping up his library card like my grandmother because they let those monsters play that awful game in there, all the while having never once opened up a D&D rulebook. EDIT www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0046and cos the parodies are hilarious www.gamegroup.org/comics/dd.phpThis is what gets me going when the Christian Right holding up JK Rowling as a martyr over her beef with the unholy transgenders: not long ago, the Christian Right was down on her for promoting witchcraft, aka Satanism as they see it. They are always literally looking for the Devil in the details, they can’t help it. And this in turn, fuels things like HUAC, black listings, and McCarthyism; the Daycare Satanic Panic; records played backwards containing Satanic messages; and the current Wokism panic.
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Post by clusium on Mar 1, 2023 0:37:28 GMT
It's crazy huh? I have played D&D since 1983, and the satanic panic was just hilarious, Erjen would be the one ripping up his library card like my grandmother because they let those monsters play that awful game in there, all the while having never once opened up a D&D rulebook. EDIT www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0046and cos the parodies are hilarious www.gamegroup.org/comics/dd.phpThis is what gets me going when the Christian Right holding up JK Rowling as a martyr over her beef with the unholy transgenders: not long ago, the Christian Right was down on her for promoting witchcraft, aka Satanism as they see it. They are always literally looking for the Devil in the details, they can’t help it. And this in turn, fuels things like HUAC, black listings, and McCarthyism; the Daycare Satanic Panic; records played backwards containing Satanic messages; and the current Wokism panic. As a devout Christian myself, I enjoyed the Harry Potter series.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 1, 2023 0:40:22 GMT
No, you think wrong, as usual. Until you mentioned it, that never occurred to me. My concern is that the state will give the churches the choice to perform these obscene marriages or have their 501(c)(3) tax exemption revoked. Under those circumstances, I think most if not all of the churches will comply. So, in your opinion, most (if not all) churches value the privileged tax status they receive from the state more than they value remaining steadfast in their beliefs. Yes. Sickening, isn't it?
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Post by gadreel on Mar 1, 2023 0:44:38 GMT
This is what gets me going when the Christian Right holding up JK Rowling as a martyr over her beef with the unholy transgenders: not long ago, the Christian Right was down on her for promoting witchcraft, aka Satanism as they see it. They are always literally looking for the Devil in the details, they can’t help it. And this in turn, fuels things like HUAC, black listings, and McCarthyism; the Daycare Satanic Panic; records played backwards containing Satanic messages; and the current Wokism panic. As a devout Christian myself, I enjoyed the Harry Potter series. So why is rape culture a thing and your stance is not??
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Post by clusium on Mar 1, 2023 0:47:53 GMT
As a devout Christian myself, I enjoyed the Harry Potter series. So why is rape culture a thing and your stance is not?? I don't know. Ask those that are for rape culture.
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Post by Isapop on Mar 1, 2023 0:50:33 GMT
So, in your opinion, most (if not all) churches value the privileged tax status they receive from the state more than they value remaining steadfast in their beliefs. Yes. Sickening, isn't it? Yes. But it wouldn't bother me because (not being a member) I don't expect better of them.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Mar 1, 2023 0:56:13 GMT
Yes. Sickening, isn't it? Yes. But it wouldn't bother me because (not being a member) I don't expect better of them. Good point. I wish I could expect better of them.
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Post by paulslaugh on Mar 1, 2023 0:57:30 GMT
So, in your opinion, most (if not all) churches value the privileged tax status they receive from the state more than they value remaining steadfast in their beliefs. Yes. Sickening, isn't it? Then they should be proud to lose the tax free status…which applies to all church properties including the pastor’s two or three McMansions, as well as several commercial aircraft…because God wants him to have it.
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Post by gadreel on Mar 1, 2023 1:07:43 GMT
So why is rape culture a thing and your stance is not?? I don't know. Ask those that are for rape culture. Are you intentionally missing the point?? My claim is that: Your stance is that homosexuality is wrong, and that believing it is wrong is a good thing and that homosexuals should be celibate. You normalise this stance, and with it you are contributing to normalising dislilke of homosexuality, this is analogous to rape culture normalising rape. You disagree, please tell me why normalisation of rape is bad (which you have agreed with), but your normalisation of the rejection of homosexuals is not. Rape culture encourages rape by normalising is, why does your normalising of dislike of homosexuals not encourage violence against homosexuals?
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Post by clusium on Mar 1, 2023 1:17:21 GMT
I don't know. Ask those that are for rape culture. Are you intentionally missing the point?? My claim is that: Your stance is that homosexuality is wrong, and that believing it is wrong is a good thing and that homosexuals should be celibate. You normalise this stance, and with it you are contributing to normalising dislilke of homosexuality, this is analogous to rape culture normalising rape. You disagree, please tell me why normalisation of rape is bad (which you have agreed with), but your normalisation of the rejection of homosexuals is not. Rape culture encourages rape by normalising is, why does your normalising of dislike of homosexuals not encourage violence against homosexuals? I fail to see what one has to do with the other (especially since the Catechism of the Catholic Church gave a much stronger condemnation of rape than it did with homosexuality).
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Mar 1, 2023 5:01:45 GMT
Are you intentionally missing the point?? My claim is that: Your stance is that homosexuality is wrong, and that believing it is wrong is a good thing and that homosexuals should be celibate. You normalise this stance, and with it you are contributing to normalising dislilke of homosexuality, this is analogous to rape culture normalising rape. You disagree, please tell me why normalisation of rape is bad (which you have agreed with), but your normalisation of the rejection of homosexuals is not. Rape culture encourages rape by normalising is, why does your normalising of dislike of homosexuals not encourage violence against homosexuals? I fail to see what one has to do with the other (especially since the Catechism of the Catholic Church gave a much stronger condemnation of rape than it did with homosexuality). gadreel, I would say this response is positive proof that clusium is intentionally missing the point. I don't see how you could have described the issue any clearer.
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Post by clusium on Mar 1, 2023 5:04:39 GMT
I fail to see what one has to do with the other (especially since the Catechism of the Catholic Church gave a much stronger condemnation of rape than it did with homosexuality). gadreel , I would say this response is positive proof that clusium is intentionally missing the point. I don't see how you could have described the issue any clearer. I'm not intentionally missing anything. I really fail to see the relevancy of gadreel's posts regarding rape culture.
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