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Post by charzhino on Sept 2, 2017 0:05:32 GMT
Its still convoluted. Maybe Zemos plan would have been recieved with more impact if Cap and IronMan didnt make up at the end of film in no time at all. Essentially a waste of 2.5 hours of the whole films plot when it doesnt change any of the major characters behaviours or attitudes to either the Sokovia Accords or Zemos failed plan. The Russos confirmed that Steve and Tony aren't talking to each other anymore. They just aren't going to pursue or fight each other but their not friends either they're in that gray area where they're just acquaintances; there is going to be some tension between them in Infinity War. Their attitudes towards each other have changed as Cap's team is a group of fugitives now. Zemo split The Avengers up so he did succeed. You and everyone else complaining about there being no consequences in Civil War will be eating your words by 2018. The films ending is clear enough they made up. And well see how it follows after all they threw Tony discarding his chestpiece in IM3 into the trash as he appeares at the beginning of Age of Ultron with no explanation of events.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 0:16:53 GMT
The Russos confirmed that Steve and Tony aren't talking to each other anymore. They just aren't going to pursue or fight each other but their not friends either they're in that gray area where they're just acquaintances; there is going to be some tension between them in Infinity War. Their attitudes towards each other have changed as Cap's team is a group of fugitives now. Zemo split The Avengers up so he did succeed. You and everyone else complaining about there being no consequences in Civil War will be eating your words by 2018. The films ending is clear enough they made up. And well see how it follows after all they threw Tony discarding his chestpiece in IM3 into the trash as he appeares at the beginning of Age of Ultron with no explanation of events. Oh, look, the 12 year old who knows nothing about drama is trying to appear intelligent again.
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Post by formersamhmd on Sept 2, 2017 1:48:33 GMT
The Russos confirmed that Steve and Tony aren't talking to each other anymore. They just aren't going to pursue or fight each other but their not friends either they're in that gray area where they're just acquaintances; there is going to be some tension between them in Infinity War. Their attitudes towards each other have changed as Cap's team is a group of fugitives now. Zemo split The Avengers up so he did succeed. You and everyone else complaining about there being no consequences in Civil War will be eating your words by 2018. The films ending is clear enough they made up. And well see how it follows after all they threw Tony discarding his chestpiece in IM3 into the trash as he appeares at the beginning of Age of Ultron with no explanation of events. Does Tony still need an Arc Reactor to live? No. So there, Iron Man 3 is acknowledged. You keep misunderstanding the ending of IM3, it wasn't about Tony saying he was quitting being Iron Man completely. It was about him becoming less obsessed the way he'd been acting throughout the film. I suppose you need Tony to be frothing at the mouth rabidly going all over the world in a nonstop quest to hunt down and murder Steve for them to "not make up".
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 13:18:03 GMT
Agreed. It's like Marvel is terrified of upsetting the status quo. Like the ending to Avengers: "Because we'll need them to." In other words, we're not actually going to bother showing any dramatic reunion/reconciliation. They'll just team up again. And that's exactly what happened with Age of Ultron. There's just so much more potential for actual character interaction/drama if Tony struggles with calling Steve, unsure of whether Steve will come to his aid. And then showing Steve, or even the rest of the fugitive Avengers, struggling with answering Tony's call for help. Wrong yet again. Its DC and Fox that's terrified of upsetting the status quo. The MCU has been trailblazing and innovating from day one and always giving us something different. Also, Tony and Steve didn't make up at the end of Civil War. You need to stop siding with the haters. If you have so little fondness for the series and aren't giving to give anyone working it on any credit, just stop watching now and go away. I'm not going to bother talking about how wrong you are about literally everything else you say in the second and third paragraphs is wrong. There will be a dramatic reunion/reconciliation, but only because Thanos will force the issues. Tony will struggle with calling Steve, and the fugitive Avengers will answering with answering Tony's call for help. However, it is nice to see your true colors as a hater. Gotta disagree. All that drama and conflict is going to be undone with a simple phone call. The movie would've ended much stronger without Steve's package to Tony. I can't really say DC's afraid of upsetting the status quo. They're still a little too busy trying to figure out what the status quo is. And you can't say Fox is afraid of upsetting the status quo, they've literally recast pretty much the entire team with new actors and killed their most popular character. That is the literal definition of upsetting the status quo.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 13:20:41 GMT
The Russos confirmed that Steve and Tony aren't talking to each other anymore. They just aren't going to pursue or fight each other but their not friends either they're in that gray area where they're just acquaintances; there is going to be some tension between them in Infinity War. Their attitudes towards each other have changed as Cap's team is a group of fugitives now. Zemo split The Avengers up so he did succeed. You and everyone else complaining about there being no consequences in Civil War will be eating your words by 2018. The films ending is clear enough they made up. And well see how it follows after all they threw Tony discarding his chestpiece in IM3 into the trash as he appeares at the beginning of Age of Ultron with no explanation of events. Agreed. Marvel's main issue seems to be bypassing any potential drama or at least not following up on it. At the end of The Avengers, the big hanging thread is how will the Avengers come back together now that they've scattered to the wind. Yet at the beginning of Age of Ultron, they're all back together fighting against evil as if nothing happened with no explanation as to how they came together.
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Post by formersamhmd on Sept 4, 2017 14:15:59 GMT
Wrong yet again. Its DC and Fox that's terrified of upsetting the status quo. The MCU has been trailblazing and innovating from day one and always giving us something different. Also, Tony and Steve didn't make up at the end of Civil War. You need to stop siding with the haters. If you have so little fondness for the series and aren't giving to give anyone working it on any credit, just stop watching now and go away. I'm not going to bother talking about how wrong you are about literally everything else you say in the second and third paragraphs is wrong. There will be a dramatic reunion/reconciliation, but only because Thanos will force the issues. Tony will struggle with calling Steve, and the fugitive Avengers will answering with answering Tony's call for help. However, it is nice to see your true colors as a hater. Gotta disagree. All that drama and conflict is going to be undone with a simple phone call. The movie would've ended much stronger without Steve's package to Tony. I can't really say DC's afraid of upsetting the status quo. They're still a little too busy trying to figure out what the status quo is. And you can't say Fox is afraid of upsetting the status quo, they've literally recast pretty much the entire team with new actors and killed their most popular character. That is the literal definition of upsetting the status quo. They killed off Logan in some far future future unconnected to the rest of the series. If they killed him in the present THEN it would be a change. As it is, it's a cop-out. As for the MCU, I suppose you need Tony to be fanatically scouring the globe in a non-stop quest to kill Steve for things to be changed?
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Post by charzhino on Sept 4, 2017 14:18:30 GMT
Agreed. Marvel's main issue seems to be bypassing any potential drama or at least not following up on it. At the end of The Avengers, the big hanging thread is how will the Avengers come back together now that they've scattered to the wind. Yet at the beginning of Age of Ultron, they're all back together fighting against evil as if nothing happened with no explanation as to how they came together. They bypass serious drama because they are cowards who need to showcase their heros as infallible instead of presenting real emotion and conflict. Its all fake.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Sept 4, 2017 14:23:55 GMT
I liked Ego more than loki. Definitely has a fascinating background.
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Post by charzhino on Sept 4, 2017 14:24:34 GMT
Gotta disagree. All that drama and conflict is going to be undone with a simple phone call. The movie would've ended much stronger without Steve's package to Tony. I can't really say DC's afraid of upsetting the status quo. They're still a little too busy trying to figure out what the status quo is. And you can't say Fox is afraid of upsetting the status quo, they've literally recast pretty much the entire team with new actors and killed their most popular character. That is the literal definition of upsetting the status quo. They killed off Logan in some far future future unconnected to the rest of the series. If they killed him in the present THEN it would be a change. As it is, it's a cop-out. As for the MCU, I suppose you need Tony to be fanatically scouring the globe in a non-stop quest to kill Steve for things to be changed? Nah, I would have like Tony and Steve to still show they are fundamentally opposed but not write a stupid love letter. These guys tried to kill each other or seriously harm their allies and the audience is meant to believe that a simple letter from Cap cleans the air? Nope not buying it. Feige wanted a happy ending to make viewer's not question the purpose of the rest of the film. Nothing is resolved or concluded. Throw in a Tony Stank joke as well to make the dumb masses forget the serious tone "Civil War" was supposed to attain. Look at the ending of Dark Knight or Xmen First Class on how serious matters are not resolved completely but leaves the audience satisfied yet still questioning.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 14:37:55 GMT
Gotta disagree. All that drama and conflict is going to be undone with a simple phone call. The movie would've ended much stronger without Steve's package to Tony. I can't really say DC's afraid of upsetting the status quo. They're still a little too busy trying to figure out what the status quo is. And you can't say Fox is afraid of upsetting the status quo, they've literally recast pretty much the entire team with new actors and killed their most popular character. That is the literal definition of upsetting the status quo. They killed off Logan in some far future future unconnected to the rest of the series. If they killed him in the present THEN it would be a change. As it is, it's a cop-out. As for the MCU, I suppose you need Tony to be fanatically scouring the globe in a non-stop quest to kill Steve for things to be changed? None the less, the character, or more precisely the actor most associated with him, is gone. That's a huge shake up to the status quo anyway you look at it. Barring a return. But as of now, that's not in the stars. And no, that is not at all what I would need for things to be changed in the MCU. I'm pretty sure I made it clear what I'd like. Simply having no scene of Steve sending Tony a "P.S. I still love you" care package. Don't know why you'd think I want Tony hunting Steve down like he was Hannibal Lecter.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 14:40:05 GMT
Agreed. Marvel's main issue seems to be bypassing any potential drama or at least not following up on it. At the end of The Avengers, the big hanging thread is how will the Avengers come back together now that they've scattered to the wind. Yet at the beginning of Age of Ultron, they're all back together fighting against evil as if nothing happened with no explanation as to how they came together. They bypass serious drama because they are cowards who need to showcase their heros as infallible instead of presenting real emotion and conflict. Its all fake. There does seem to be some underlying fear that fans might not return for the next movie if they felt the Avengers wouldn't be reunited, which is just ridiculous. Fans will turn up no matter what. This sadly impacts the MCU's biggest strength. Not the crazy battles. Not the cosmic-spanning story arc. Not the villains. But the character interactions. The drama between all these people.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 14:51:48 GMT
The films ending is clear enough they made up. And well see how it follows after all they threw Tony discarding his chestpiece in IM3 into the trash as he appeares at the beginning of Age of Ultron with no explanation of events. Agreed. Marvel's main issue seems to be bypassing any potential drama or at least not following up on it. At the end of The Avengers, the big hanging thread is how will the Avengers come back together now that they've scattered to the wind. Yet at the beginning of Age of Ultron, they're all back together fighting against evil as if nothing happened with no explanation as to how they came together. That explanation was given in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. . #itsallconnected
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 14:54:54 GMT
Agreed. Marvel's main issue seems to be bypassing any potential drama or at least not following up on it. At the end of The Avengers, the big hanging thread is how will the Avengers come back together now that they've scattered to the wind. Yet at the beginning of Age of Ultron, they're all back together fighting against evil as if nothing happened with no explanation as to how they came together. That explanation was given in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. . #itsallconnected And yet, Joss has said the show is not connected. And that Coulson is still dead in the movies. Besides, if the answer was given in a show, that doesn't disprove the movies' weaknesses for not providing answers. Supplemental material is nice, but it shouldn't be used to fill in unexplained plots.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 14:56:54 GMT
They killed off Logan in some far future future unconnected to the rest of the series. If they killed him in the present THEN it would be a change. As it is, it's a cop-out. As for the MCU, I suppose you need Tony to be fanatically scouring the globe in a non-stop quest to kill Steve for things to be changed? Nah, I would have like Tony and Steve to still show they are fundamentally opposed but not write a stupid love letter. These guys tried to kill each other or seriously harm their allies and the audience is meant to believe that a simple letter from Cap cleans the air? Nope not buying it. Feige wanted a happy ending to make viewer's not question the purpose of the rest of the film. Nothing is resolved or concluded. Throw in a Tony Stank joke as well to make the dumb masses forget the serious tone "Civil War" was supposed to attain. Look at the ending of Dark Knight or Xmen First Class on how serious matters are not resolved completely but leaves the audience satisfied yet still questioning. The love letter came from Steve. Tony's reaction to Steve we dont know. Yes he lets the prison breakout take place but during the movie he already concluded that the people in there were wrongfully imprisoned. How he is going to react to Steve and Bucky is unknown as far as we know. I do think your speculation about their relationship has merit but its not a fact.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 15:00:00 GMT
That explanation was given in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. . #itsallconnected And yet, Joss has said the show is not connected. And that Coulson is still dead in the movies. Besides, if the answer was given in a show, that doesn't disprove the movies' weaknesses for not providing answers. Supplemental material is nice, but it shouldn't be used to fill in unexplained plots. Marvel herself uses that hashtag every time a new movie comes out and AoS deals with it. So screw what Whedon says, the people who fired him says its connected. The MCU is bigger than just the movies. Deal with it. Your point is mute.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 15:04:07 GMT
Marvel's a woman? Interesting. In any case, as I said, a show shouldn't do the job of the movies for them. Besides, nothing from the show has impacted the movies. Coulson still hasn't even shown up. Marvel's even said that their Netflix shows won't crossover into the movies, and that they don't exist in connection with each other. So it can't be that much bigger. They can hashtag all they want, but it doesn't change that there are no explanations.
And the word is "moot."
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 15:15:32 GMT
Marvel's a woman? Interesting. In any case, as I said, a show shouldn't do the job of the movies for them. Besides, nothing from the show has impacted the movies. Coulson still hasn't even shown up. Marvel's even said that their Netflix shows won't crossover into the movies, and that they don't exist in connection with each other. So it can't be that much bigger. They can hashtag all they want, but it doesn't change that there are no explanations. And the word is "moot." Oh sorry, English is not my native language Your opinion. Irrelevant. Fact is it has been explained in the MCU.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 4, 2017 15:23:14 GMT
Apology accepted.
But it was explained on a tv show. In which case, what about audiences in China, England, and the rest of the world that don't get ABC?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 16:02:44 GMT
Apology accepted. But it was explained on a tv show. In which case, what about audiences in China, England, and the rest of the world that don't get ABC? Thats my main complain about Marvel. The TV part on ABC doesnt get aired everywhere. In fact, they dont put it out on disc everywhere. So its hard for fans like me to see all. I have to import AoS, Agent Carter aso from the UK 1.5 years after the season finale in the US. But that doesnt mean there is no explanation. Its just not available on time for the overseas fans. Which is kinda stupid because the overseas fanbase is twice or thrice the size of the US fan base.
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Post by DC-Fan on Sept 4, 2017 19:22:25 GMT
Agreed. Marvel's main issue seems to be bypassing any potential drama or at least not following up on it. At the end of The Avengers, the big hanging thread is how will the Avengers come back together now that they've scattered to the wind. Yet at the beginning of Age of Ultron, they're all back together fighting against evil as if nothing happened with no explanation as to how they came together. That explanation was given in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. . #itsallconnected That's a weak excuse. A movie isn't supposed to depend on a TV show to fill in the plotholes in the movie. That's just awful movie-making and the weak excuse "It's explained in a TV show. They're all connected." is not only the weakest excuse of all but a BULLSHIT excuse because there's hardly any connection between the TV shows and movies, other than brief mentions.
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