|
|
Post by Lord Death Man on Mar 4, 2018 5:47:53 GMT
Even if you agree with DC-Fan’s psychotic rant - which no one on this entire board seems to, it doesn’t prove in any quantifiable or sane way that the movie deserves a 1 out of 10 rating. He’s got you all on the back foot arguing a premise that is riddled with logical fallacies and amounts to nothing more than his opinion. His reasoning is completely arbitrary. I could argue, just as passionately and vehemently, that because Wakandan tradition blends technological advancement with age old rituals, the movie is worthy of a 10 out of 10 due to its inventiveness and imagination. He’s acting as if Black Panther were the first movie to depict an advanced civilization that engaged in a morally dubious practice. It’s not. He’s obviously consumed by jealousy and rage over this films undeniably success. All he has is an extremist, minority opinion that he is trying desperately to posit as fact, when in reality, it falls apart with even the most cursory scrutiny. |
|
Surly
Sophomore
@surly
Posts: 913
Likes: 784
 
|
Post by Surly on Mar 4, 2018 6:33:33 GMT
The only problem with your take on this is - this kind of dichotomy has existed in history. You think that savagery and technology can't coexist. But it did in the Roman Empire. The Romans weapons, armor, and battle strategy had a head start on some nations of approximately 500 years. And when their empire collapsed it set back personal hygiene in the Western world for a thousand years! Yet they entertained themselves with savage competitions and gory executions in the Roman arena. Their eating habits were to consume food until you were so stuffed that you puked, then go back for more! Dichotomies of savagery and technological advances and civicness have already existed in human history. The ancient Romans weren't really technologically advanced or have advanced weapons. They didn't have guns or tanks. They fought battles with swords and shields and bows and arrows and horses and chariots just like their enemies did. The ancient Romans just had smarter generals, like Julius Caesar. In fact, it's precisely because the ancient Romans weren't technologically advanced that they entertained themselves with savage competitions and gory executions in the Colisseum. Let's face it. Life in ancient Rome must've been pretty boring. No TV, no movies, no Internet, no technology. And if you wanted to take a vacation, you couldn't just get in your car and drive somewhere or get on a plane and fly somewhere. You had to travel by horse, and your horse could only travel so far in a day. There was no technology in ancient Rome and the only "sporting event" you could watch in Rome was gladiators fighting. So it's precisely because the ancient Romans weren't technologically advanced and thus had no other form of entertainment that they had to entertain themselves by watching gladiators fight. But in the 21st century, there's TV, movies, Internet. If you wanted to take a vacation halfway around the world, you could fly there in less than a full day. And plenty of sporting events to watch. So it's just stupid for a nation that's supposedly technologically advanced to still resort to choosing a leader by such a barbaric and savage tradition. If you're supposedly the most technologically advanced nation in the world, how is it that none of your citizens are smart enough to come up with a peaceful way to choose a leader in the 21st century that doesn't involve bloodshed, especially when most of the rest of the world has already done so? It just doesn't make any sense at all, and that's 1 of the reasons why Black Panther deserves a 1/10 rating. That's where you're totally wrong. For their era they were extremely advanced in comparison to most of the rest of world. So your argument about time period is irrelevant. And again, being isolationists would influence their development. That's true even in nature. Madagascar and Australia have some of the most unique animal species in the world because of being isolated from other major continents for such a long period of time. You started your argument on the premise of being a Marvel hating DC fan. That was the main motive behind your argument. And that's why it doesn't hold up. Because you didn't stop and check if it had more foundation than that. If your fault has already occurred historically then your complaint is flawed. And here's one more thing, president Trump ignores "green technology" and rejects global warming policies. According to you no technologically advanced nation today would choose isolationist policy or social customs. Nice talking to you. Good luck with that Swiss cheese argument. |
|
Surly
Sophomore
@surly
Posts: 913
Likes: 784
|
Post by Surly on Mar 4, 2018 6:34:43 GMT
Even if you agree with DC-Fan’s psychotic rant - which no one on this entire board seems to, it doesn’t prove in any quantifiable or sane way that the movie deserves a 1 out of 10 rating. He’s got you all on the back foot arguing a premise that is riddled with logical fallacies and amounts to nothing more than his opinion. His reasoning is completely arbitrary. I could argue, just as passionately and vehemently, that because Wakandan tradition blends technological advancement with age old rituals, the movie is worthy of a 10 out of 10 due to its inventiveness and imagination. He’s acting as if Black Panther were the first movie to depict an advanced civilization that engaged in a morally dubious practice. It’s not. He’s obviously consumed by jealousy and rage over this films undeniably success. All he has is an extremist, minority opinion that he is trying desperately to posit as fact, when in reality, it falls apart with even the most cursory scrutiny. Well said. A perfect take on his argument. |
|
|
|
Post by Lord Death Man on Mar 4, 2018 7:02:11 GMT
The ancient Romans weren't really technologically advanced or have advanced weapons. They didn't have guns or tanks. They fought battles with swords and shields and bows and arrows and horses and chariots just like their enemies did. The ancient Romans just had smarter generals, like Julius Caesar. In fact, it's precisely because the ancient Romans weren't technologically advanced that they entertained themselves with savage competitions and gory executions in the Colisseum. Let's face it. Life in ancient Rome must've been pretty boring. No TV, no movies, no Internet, no technology. And if you wanted to take a vacation, you couldn't just get in your car and drive somewhere or get on a plane and fly somewhere. You had to travel by horse, and your horse could only travel so far in a day. There was no technology in ancient Rome and the only "sporting event" you could watch in Rome was gladiators fighting. So it's precisely because the ancient Romans weren't technologically advanced and thus had no other form of entertainment that they had to entertain themselves by watching gladiators fight. But in the 21st century, there's TV, movies, Internet. If you wanted to take a vacation halfway around the world, you could fly there in less than a full day. And plenty of sporting events to watch. So it's just stupid for a nation that's supposedly technologically advanced to still resort to choosing a leader by such a barbaric and savage tradition. If you're supposedly the most technologically advanced nation in the world, how is it that none of your citizens are smart enough to come up with a peaceful way to choose a leader in the 21st century that doesn't involve bloodshed, especially when most of the rest of the world has already done so? It just doesn't make any sense at all, and that's 1 of the reasons why Black Panther deserves a 1/10 rating. That's where you're totally wrong. For their era they were extremely advanced in comparison to most of the rest of world. So your argument about time period is irrelevant. And again, being isolationists would influence their development. That's true even in nature. Madagascar and Australia have some of the most unique animal species in the world because of being isolated from other major continents for such a long period of time. You started your argument on the premise of being a Marvel hating DC fan. That was the main motive behind your argument. And that's why it doesn't hold up. Because you didn't stop and check if it had more foundation than that. If your fault has already occurred historically then your complaint is flawed. And here's one more thing, president Trump ignores "green technology" and rejects global warming policies. According to you no technologically advanced nation today would choose isolationist policy or social customs. Nice talking to you. Good luck with that Swiss cheese argument. All the luck in the world wouldn’t change the fact the Black Panther is one of the most critically acclaimed and financially successful superhero films of all time. DC-Fan frequently resorts to half truths and lies to bolster his weak and repetitive arguments. There are those with limited intellect who believe that if they say a lie enough times it somehow becomes the truth. I’m surprised at how he has managed to get seemingly intelligent and rational people to engage with him, for an extended period of time, on this basis. Nakia never said anything about her gender being a factor in her decision not to take the heart-shaped herb but, DC fan insists that she did because it fits his warped narrative that MCU films are somehow anti-feminist and misogynistic. |
|
|
|
Post by darkpast on Mar 4, 2018 7:14:48 GMT
Coming To America
|
|
|
|
Post by DC-Fan on Mar 4, 2018 7:18:54 GMT
The ancient Romans weren't really technologically advanced or have advanced weapons. They didn't have guns or tanks. They fought battles with swords and shields and bows and arrows and horses and chariots just like their enemies did. The ancient Romans just had smarter generals, like Julius Caesar. In fact, it's precisely because the ancient Romans weren't technologically advanced that they entertained themselves with savage competitions and gory executions in the Colisseum. Let's face it. Life in ancient Rome must've been pretty boring. No TV, no movies, no Internet, no technology. And if you wanted to take a vacation, you couldn't just get in your car and drive somewhere or get on a plane and fly somewhere. You had to travel by horse, and your horse could only travel so far in a day. There was no technology in ancient Rome and the only "sporting event" you could watch in Rome was gladiators fighting. So it's precisely because the ancient Romans weren't technologically advanced and thus had no other form of entertainment that they had to entertain themselves by watching gladiators fight. But in the 21st century, there's TV, movies, Internet. If you wanted to take a vacation halfway around the world, you could fly there in less than a full day. And plenty of sporting events to watch. So it's just stupid for a nation that's supposedly technologically advanced to still resort to choosing a leader by such a barbaric and savage tradition. If you're supposedly the most technologically advanced nation in the world, how is it that none of your citizens are smart enough to come up with a peaceful way to choose a leader in the 21st century that doesn't involve bloodshed, especially when most of the rest of the world has already done so? It just doesn't make any sense at all, and that's 1 of the reasons why Black Panther deserves a 1/10 rating. That's where you're totally wrong. For their era they were extremely advanced in comparison to most of the rest of world. So your argument about time period is irrelevant. And again, being isolationists would influence their development. That's true even in nature. Madagascar and Australia have some of the most unique animal species in the world because of being isolated from other major continents for such a long period of time. You started your argument on the premise of being a Marvel hating DC fan. That was the main motive behind your argument. And that's why it doesn't hold up. Because you didn't stop and check if it had more foundation than that. If your fault has already occurred historically then your complaint is flawed. And here's one more thing, president Trump ignores "green technology" and rejects global warming policies. According to you no technologically advanced nation today would choose isolationist policy or social customs. Nice talking to you. Good luck with that Swiss cheese argument. No, your argument is flawed. Because you don't even understand it. Of course, it has happened historically! When humans weren't as civilized as they are now and were barbaric and savage!
That's the whole point! Civilization advances. And along with advancement is the elimination of barbaric and savage traditions, like choosing a leader by bloodshed and mortal combat.
But Wakanda is still so far behind the rest of the world that they still resort to a barbaric and savage tradition to choose their leader. Which is why it makes no sense at all for the writers to say that Wakanda is technologically advanced because, while humans craved barbaric and savage traditions at a time when they were less civilized, technologically advanced nations in the 21st century don't hold on to such barbaric and savage traditions.
Moreover, IT'S ALSO HAPPENED HISTORICALLY THAT IF SOMEONE GOT CAUGHT STEALING, THEY GOT THEIR HAND CHOPPED OFF. SO BASED ON YOUR REALLY STUPID ARGUMENT, YOU'RE SAYING THAT CHOPPING OFF SOMEONE'S HAND FOR STEALING IN THE 21ST CENTURY IS OK AND WOULDN'T BE BARBARIC AND SAVAGE. THAT'S HOW STUPID YOUR ARGUMENT IS!
|
|
|
|
Post by DC-Fan on Mar 4, 2018 7:20:33 GMT
That's where you're totally wrong. For their era they were extremely advanced in comparison to most of the rest of world. So your argument about time period is irrelevant. And again, being isolationists would influence their development. That's true even in nature. Madagascar and Australia have some of the most unique animal species in the world because of being isolated from other major continents for such a long period of time. You started your argument on the premise of being a Marvel hating DC fan. That was the main motive behind your argument. And that's why it doesn't hold up. Because you didn't stop and check if it had more foundation than that. If your fault has already occurred historically then your complaint is flawed. And here's one more thing, president Trump ignores "green technology" and rejects global warming policies. According to you no technologically advanced nation today would choose isolationist policy or social customs. Nice talking to you. Good luck with that Swiss cheese argument. All the luck in the world wouldn’t change the fact the Black Panther is one of the most critically acclaimed and financially successful superhero films of all time. Which means nothing, since everyone knows that the critics gave Black Panther high ratings only because they're afraid of being called racist by the SJWs. |
|
|
|
Post by Lord Death Man on Mar 4, 2018 7:28:37 GMT
All the luck in the world wouldn’t change the fact the Black Panther is one of the most critically acclaimed and financially successful superhero films of all time. Which means nothing, since everyone knows that the critics gave Black Panther high ratings only because they're afraid of being called racist by the SJWs. It’s a fact any you need to come to terms with it. That’s what adults do when they are presented by incontrovertible facts about the world that are hurtful to them or run counter to their beliefs. “Everyone” knows no such thing and you saying it over and over again doesn’t make it true. You’re a practiced liar and a sore, ugly loser. |
|
|
|
Post by Hauntedknight87 on Mar 4, 2018 10:23:46 GMT
I mean we're talking about a piece of Africa that closed itself off from everyone. So Wakadans don't have Internet or satellite TV? If Wakanda is supposed to be the most technologically advanced nation in the world, how is it that Wakandans are too stupid to come up with a peaceful way to choose a leader in the 21st century, especially when most of the rest of the world has already done so? Just because they're technology advance doesn't mean they have to change how they elect their leader. At least the way they do it people who want to be a leader actually have to prove themselves. In our so called "civilized" country our election could easily be rigged, hell some people would argue that it's been rigged for decades. So I don't have a problem with how wakanda chooses it's king. If we did this in America we wouldn't have to worry about old, mostly white l, people from the 1950's fucking everything up. |
|
|
|
Post by Hauntedknight87 on Mar 4, 2018 10:33:48 GMT
All the luck in the world wouldn’t change the fact the Black Panther is one of the most critically acclaimed and financially successful superhero films of all time. Which means nothing, since everyone knows that the critics gave Black Panther high ratings only because they're afraid of being called racist by the SJWs. Couldn't you make the same argument with Wonder Woman? Couldn't you just say "the only reason Wonder Woman has high ratings is because critics didn't want to be called sexist". |
|
|
|
Post by formersamhmd on Mar 4, 2018 12:13:57 GMT
If they had a very real God telling them to do so, like the Wakandans do, they would. You keep ignoring that. They have a real God telling them to do so. Wakandans don't have a real God. They only have stories passed down from generation to generation as myths or legend, like Bigfoot and the Loch Ness Monster. Nope, they have mystical powers that let them speak to the dead spirits. That backs up the story of the Panther God and all the spirits attest to said God. They got more proof of a God than any other religion on Earth. You are VERY disrespectful of other cultures with this attitude, Ken. |
|
|
|
Post by formersamhmd on Mar 4, 2018 12:16:21 GMT
being able to speak with Ancestors who can attest to the Panther God. Hallucinations. They're not speaking to their Ancestors. Those spirits know things that the person speaking to them doesn't, it's real and they can speak to the dead. And we know magic exists in the MCU so this is nothing unexpected or unbelievable. You must hate Star Wars, they speak to the dead too. |
|
|
|
Post by formersamhmd on Mar 4, 2018 12:18:08 GMT
That's where you're totally wrong. For their era they were extremely advanced in comparison to most of the rest of world. So your argument about time period is irrelevant. And again, being isolationists would influence their development. That's true even in nature. Madagascar and Australia have some of the most unique animal species in the world because of being isolated from other major continents for such a long period of time. You started your argument on the premise of being a Marvel hating DC fan. That was the main motive behind your argument. And that's why it doesn't hold up. Because you didn't stop and check if it had more foundation than that. If your fault has already occurred historically then your complaint is flawed. And here's one more thing, president Trump ignores "green technology" and rejects global warming policies. According to you no technologically advanced nation today would choose isolationist policy or social customs. Nice talking to you. Good luck with that Swiss cheese argument. No, your argument is flawed. Because you don't even understand it. Of course, it has happened historically! When humans weren't as civilized as they are now and were barbaric and savage!
Actually, there were cases where prior Human civilizations were more progressive than societies that exist today. |
|
|
|
Post by DC-Fan on Mar 4, 2018 17:45:57 GMT
So Wakadans don't have Internet or satellite TV? If Wakanda is supposed to be the most technologically advanced nation in the world, how is it that Wakandans are too stupid to come up with a peaceful way to choose a leader in the 21st century, especially when most of the rest of the world has already done so? Just because they're technology advance doesn't mean they have to change how they elect their leader. At least the way they do it people who want to be a leader actually have to prove themselves. So "proving" yourself worthy to be leader means you just have to prove that you have the most brute strength and it doesn't matter if you're the dumbest asshole in the nation as long as you have the most brute strength? If that's the case, then the Hulk could challenge for the throne of Wakanda and be the leader because intelligence isn't a qualification to be leader of Wakanda. That would also explain why T'Challa accepted Killmonger's challenge without a DNA test to verify that Killmonger really is who he claims he is and not just an imposter hired by Klaue to take over the throne.
And as for the MCU fan who claimed that accepting Killmonger's challenge without verification deters other challengers, that's 100% false. If an unamarried woman claimed that a married man was the father of her child and wanted him to pay child support, would Wakanda law say "We accept the woman's claim. No DNA test needed"? If that's the case, then MORE not LESS women would make similar claims. Likewise, T'Challa accepting Killmonger's challenge without any DNA verification would invite plenty more challenges from imposters.
Just another case of an over-rated and over-hyped MCU movie with plenty of bad writing.
|
|
|
|
Post by DC-Fan on Mar 4, 2018 18:01:10 GMT
Which means nothing, since everyone knows that the critics gave Black Panther high ratings only because they're afraid of being called racist by the SJWs. Couldn't you make the same argument with Wonder Woman? Couldn't you just say "the only reason Wonder Woman has high ratings is because critics didn't want to be called sexist". No, because the critics rating for Wonder Woman is only 4% higher than the audience rating so it's within the statistical margin of error. The critics rating for Black Panther is a whopping 18% higher than the audience rating so that clearly proves that Black Panther is over-rated and the critics are just afraid to give Black Panther a lower rating because they're afraid to be called racist by the SJWs. |
|
|
|
Post by DC-Fan on Mar 4, 2018 18:03:06 GMT
Wakandans don't have a real God. They only have stories passed down from generation to generation as myths or legend, like Bigfoot and the Loch Ness Monster. Nope, they have mystical powers that let them speak to the dead spirits. That backs up the story of the Panther God and all the spirits attest to said God. They got more proof of a God than any other religion on Earth. Nope, they have drugs that let hem have hallucinations about speaking to dead spirits. Got news for you. Other coubntries have the same drugs too. Hallucinations about speaking to dead spirits isn't anything new. And hallucinations aren't any proof of a God. |
|
|
|
Post by Vassaggo on Mar 4, 2018 18:06:05 GMT
All the luck in the world wouldn’t change the fact the Black Panther is one of the most critically acclaimed and financially successful superhero films of all time. Which means nothing, since everyone knows that the critics gave Black Panther high ratings only because they're afraid of being called racist by the SJWs. Sure that's exactly why it got that critical approval. Also Disney paid off the critics. Critics fearing SJW, actually paid for people to see it. That way it's less suspicious about that high rating. I mean they did the exact same thing with Wonder Woman so they knew it would work. It's common knowledge. Hell the overlords at Rotten Tomatoes sent me 25 bucks to take myself and a +1 to both. I couldn't have been the only one. Who else got their's? |
|
|
|
Post by damngumby on Mar 4, 2018 21:28:01 GMT
No, because the critics rating for Wonder Woman is only 4% higher than the audience rating so it's within the statistical margin of error. The critics rating for Black Panther is a whopping 18% higher than the audience rating so that clearly proves that Black Panther is over-rated and the critics are just afraid to give Black Panther a lower rating because they're afraid to be called racist by the SJWs. Well, well ... Looks like someone finally figured out what a statistical margin of error is. Progress! To bad its being applied to an online survey that doesn't require a participant to actually see the movie. Folks exiting the theater gave it a rare A+. Factor in a stellar 3rd week box office, and its clear that critics and audiences agree. Black Panther is the greatest superhero movie of all time! |
|
|
|
Post by Hauntedknight87 on Mar 4, 2018 22:20:44 GMT
Couldn't you make the same argument with Wonder Woman? Couldn't you just say "the only reason Wonder Woman has high ratings is because critics didn't want to be called sexist". No, because the critics rating for Wonder Woman is only 4% higher than the audience rating so it's within the statistical margin of error. The critics rating for Black Panther is a whopping 18% higher than the audience rating so that clearly proves that Black Panther is over-rated and the critics are just afraid to give Black Panther a lower rating because they're afraid to be called racist by the SJWs. Man I cannot believe how many of you jump on the anti-SJW train. Seriously the 2016 election really drove you guys insane. I'm actually surprised that you didn't go around calling anyone who liked Black Panther or Wonder Woman a cuck. I haven't seen this much insanity since the Gamergate controversy. |
|
|
|
Post by Hauntedknight87 on Mar 4, 2018 22:41:23 GMT
Just because they're technology advance doesn't mean they have to change how they elect their leader. At least the way they do it people who want to be a leader actually have to prove themselves. So "proving" yourself worthy to be leader means you just have to prove that you have the most brute strength and it doesn't matter if you're the dumbest asshole in the nation as long as you have the most brute strength? If that's the case, then the Hulk could challenge for the throne of Wakanda and be the leader because intelligence isn't a qualification to be leader of Wakanda. That would also explain why T'Challa accepted Killmonger's challenge without a DNA test to verify that Killmonger really is who he claims he is and not just an imposter hired by Klaue to take over the throne.
And as for the MCU fan who claimed that accepting Killmonger's challenge without verification deters other challengers, that's 100% false. If an unamarried woman claimed that a married man was the father of her child and wanted him to pay child support, would Wakanda law say "We accept the woman's claim. No DNA test needed"? If that's the case, then MORE not LESS women would make similar claims. Likewise, T'Challa accepting Killmonger's challenge without any DNA verification would invite plenty more challenges from imposters.
Just another case of an over-rated and over-hyped MCU movie with plenty of bad writing.
It's been awhile since I've watched Black Panther, but if I recall Zuri (played wonderfully by Forrest Whitaker) was the one who confirmed Erik blood relation to T'challa. Zuri was sent to spy on Erik father, N'Jobu, and was present for his death. Zuri is respected by T'challa and his council, so it's not unreasonable for them not to believe him. I agree with you that they could have handled it better, but whatever it's over and done with. BTW Killmonger in the comics hated white people too, so it wasn't so much as Marvel "SJW" it's just they're following the source material. |
|
