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Post by charzhino on Nov 11, 2018 15:59:44 GMT
Apparently, it is you who can not consider a black women capable of such status without a long explaination as to how she achieved the genius level intellect depicted by Shuri in BP. That’s your hang up. Don’t try to shed it off on others. No one is saying that though.
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Post by charzhino on Nov 11, 2018 16:01:10 GMT
is not actually silly or a flimsy explanation. xmen first class, did the hard work to make studying a thing. it also shows mcu movies have poor thin screenplays. check out xmen first class. xavier at oxford
see this is why xmen movies are superior. they are realistic and grounded and have depth. we see xavier in oxford, studying. DOFP heavily implied he was a doctor because Trask reads his paper on genetics and takes it to the usa and russia government warning them of the threat mutants are.
goodness, only mcu fans will try to spin universities as silly makes sense your movies appeals to the brainless masses.
black panther is a generic movie compared to first class, ofcourse you will never see shuri actually studying or in uni or writing academic essays like xavier did.
Uhuh. And what kind of Oxford degree does Xavier have that explains how he got the knowledge to build Cerebro? Or are you implying that every Oxford graduate just happens to have the knowledge to build something that complex? Hank McCoy builds cerebro in First Class.
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 11, 2018 16:02:59 GMT
Only in the TDK trilogy. Fox didn't exist in the other Batman movies. As for Shuri, my point still stands. Ivy league universities would be next to useless in teaching someone how to build Wakandan tech, so Shuri's skill is definitely something she couldn't have learned in a university. You're also assuming that Wakandan education is worse than Ivy League universities. Vibranium is an element/alloy like any other traditional metal and needs experts in diagnostics in metallurgy chemistry to characterise and manipulate it. Wakanda would need a lot of inorganic analytical machinery to control vibranium. Sure they can just buy these from abroad, but would require experts to operate. One decent explanation I read was that some Wakandans would go abroad and study in foreign universities to relay the information back to Wakanda when they came home, siphoning the knowledge. That would make good sense. So Shuri may have been home schooled by one of these people. I wish they would drop a line in the film to suggest that, like they have with other comic book genuises like Stark and Banner. Why would you assume that Wakanda doesn't have their own experts in metallurgy and machinery? The vibranium asteroid landed on Wakanda millions of years ago. By the time the first African tribes stumbled upon it it's very doubtful that there would already have been people in other parts of the world who had machinery or were expert chemists. I hope you're not implying that people from other countries were not capable of learning metallurgy unless they studied in North America? In any case, this is all irrelevant to Shuri. We know for a fact that by the time Shuri was born, Wakanda already had technology far more advanced than the rest of the world. Sending her to study in an outside university might have taught her more about history or arts or politics and other stuff, but when it came to scientific and technological know-how for handling vibranium it's clear that Wakanda was far more advanced than the rest of the world. So again I ask, why would she need to go abroad for studies when it's clear they had more knowledge back home (at least in regards to what she was shown to be good at)? And why do you think Shuri was home-schooled? Wakanda was an entire country with more advanced technology than the rest of the world. They would have had schools and universities of their own.
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 11, 2018 16:04:02 GMT
Uhuh. And what kind of Oxford degree does Xavier have that explains how he got the knowledge to build Cerebro? Or are you implying that every Oxford graduate just happens to have the knowledge to build something that complex? Hank McCoy builds cerebro in First Class. My mistake. Still the same question though: what kind of Ivy League degree gives students the knowledge to build a machine capable of wiping out humanity when hooked up to a telepath?
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Post by charzhino on Nov 11, 2018 16:04:56 GMT
Hank McCoy builds cerebro in First Class. My mistake. Still the same question though: what kind of Oxford degree gives students the knowledge to build a machine capable of wiping out humanity when hooked up to a telepath? He graduated Harvad at 15. Presumably in bio engineering since he built the Xjet too.
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 11, 2018 16:08:14 GMT
My mistake. Still the same question though: what kind of Oxford degree gives students the knowledge to build a machine capable of wiping out humanity when hooked up to a telepath? He graduated Harvad at 15. Presumably in bio engineering since he built the Xjet too. I changed my answer to "Ivy League" so it's all encompassing. Anyway, last I checked bio engineering students in real life aren't capable of creating machines as complex as cerebro - especially since there's no such machine like cerebro in real life. I'm pretty sure there's also no bio engineering student who has built a jet as complex as the Xjet on their lonesome.
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Post by summers8 on Nov 11, 2018 16:08:56 GMT
in xmen, mutation and human genetics is explained with real science hypothesises that has depth. Of course the “real science hypothesis that has depth” can not possibly explain the wide variety of fantastical (and often ridiculous) charactors depicted in X-men. Anyone who thinks the X-men is based on “real science” must be completely daft in the head. I said Science hypothesis like another standard good science fiction series like say maybe star trek. yikes...once again mcu fans show their stupidity.
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 11, 2018 16:11:51 GMT
Of course the “real science hypothesis that has depth” can not possibly explain the wide variety of fantastical (and often ridiculous) charactors depicted in X-men. Anyone who thinks the X-men is based on “real science” must be completely daft in the head. I said Science hypothesis like another standard good science fiction series like say maybe star trek. yikes...once again mcu fans show their stupidity. What, and you think the MCU doesn't have it's own pseudo science hypothesis just like Star Trek? Yikes... once again Summers8 shows his stupidity.
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Post by charzhino on Nov 11, 2018 16:25:44 GMT
Why would you assume that Wakanda doesn't have their own experts in metallurgy and machinery? The experts would have to have acquired their knowledge from somewhere outside Africa. To handle and manipulate a rare metal like Vibranium needs high level expertise. Before the asteroid hit Wakanda, we can assume it was like any other heartland African country - poor and underdeveloped. Not a place where world leading experts in chemistry reside. Well think what would likely happen in real life today. A new metallic elememt is found is South Sudan. You can bet that American/Europeon/Japanese chemists would be called to invesitgate, analyse and study the newly found metal. The tribes who originally found the metal centuries ago is odd. The film doesnt really expand on how they went from primitive society to technically advanced one whilst keeping the Wakandan state secret. Vibranium in that sense is depicted as some sort of unknown magical entity that can cure disease, levitate objects, absorb and redistribute energy etc. Its not simple as adamantium which is basically only used to fortify other existing structures. Back in the iron age of earth, theres only so much you could do with iron. Nowadays with technology you can do a lot more. Early Wakandans who found vibranium should have been limited in what they could do because technology wasnt around for them to advance the metals functionality. The whole point is that Wakanda is a secret state. You cant develop to that level of technology if you dont collaborate internationally. Its not possible. The person who taught shuri must have gained knowledge from outside of Wakanda. Unless you are claiming Wakanda invented every single piece of metallurgy analytical techniques to ever exist so there would be no need to go to the outside world. Tell me, how would Wakandans know how to build a scanning electron microscope to study surface defects of Vibranium? Unless they invented it (in which case theyd have to have built every single piece of metallurgy analytical devices that ever have existed) then someone from Wakanda must have travelled outside to gain that knowledge and bring it back.
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Post by charzhino on Nov 11, 2018 16:33:55 GMT
He graduated Harvad at 15. Presumably in bio engineering since he built the Xjet too. I changed my answer to "Ivy League" so it's all encompassing. Anyway, last I checked bio engineering students in real life aren't capable of creating machines as complex as cerebro - especially since there's no such machine like cerebro in real life. I'm pretty sure there's also no bio engineering student who has built a jet as complex as the Xjet on their lonesome. Doesnt matter. Narrative wise they gave a brief explanation as to how a character gained his abilties. Good writing. Tony Stark building the nanotech suit in IW is reasonable because we know about his background in physics and engineering, hes a very smart guy. If Peter Quill had a similar suit and claimed to build it himself, it would be very dubious and a cop out. Same reason i agree with the criticism of Kitty Pryde in DOFP. She can suddenly send people back in time even though her abilities have been shown to be only phasing.
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Post by Skaathar on Nov 11, 2018 17:12:13 GMT
Why would you assume that Wakanda doesn't have their own experts in metallurgy and machinery? The experts would have to have acquired their knowledge from somewhere outside Africa. To handle and manipulate a rare metal like Vibranium needs high level expertise. Before the asteroid hit Wakanda, we can assume it was like any other heartland African country - poor and underdeveloped. Not a place where world leading experts in chemistry reside. Well think what would likely happen in real life today. A new metallic elememt is found is South Sudan. You can bet that American/Europeon/Japanese chemists would be called to invesitgate, analyse and study the newly found metal. The tribes who originally found the metal centuries ago is odd. The film doesnt really expand on how they went from primitive society to technically advanced one whilst keeping the Wakandan state secret. Vibranium in that sense is depicted as some sort of unknown magical entity that can cure disease, levitate objects, absorb and redistribute energy etc. Its not simple as adamantium which is basically only used to fortify other existing structures. Back in the iron age of earth, theres only so much you could do with iron. Nowadays with technology you can do a lot more. Early Wakandans who found vibranium should have been limited in what they could do because technology wasnt around for them to advance the metals functionality. The whole point is that Wakanda is a secret state. You cant develop to that level of technology if you dont collaborate internationally. Its not possible. The person who taught shuri must have gained knowledge from outside of Wakanda. Unless you are claiming Wakanda invented every single piece of metallurgy analytical techniques to ever exist so there would be no need to go to the outside world. Tell me, how would Wakandans know how to build a scanning electron microscope to study surface defects of Vibranium? Unless they invented it (in which case theyd have to have built every single piece of metallurgy analytical devices that ever have existed) then someone from Wakanda must have travelled outside to gain that knowledge and bring it back. A million years ago, there was no human on earth who had knowledge about machinery. When the Wakandans first found the vibranium, there was no one else to ask. It's almost like you're saying that these wakandans were incapable of developing stuff on their own. No, they didn't need the help of other nations when they were already the most advanced nation around. Remember that China developed advanced metallurgy way before North America did, so it's not like they needed to cross study with them. Now did modern day Wakandans study outside for further knowledge? Sure, why not? That still doesn't change the fact that they're far more advanced than other countries and Shuri would have no need to study in an outside university for her knowledge. When you're already in the most advanced country in the world, why bother studying somewhere else?
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Post by DC-Fan on Nov 11, 2018 17:34:35 GMT
Creating a Mary-Sue is the easy way to add value to a female character but it lacks substance. Why can’t the MCU create believably empowered females? Don’t they consider women capable of such status? Except the MCU has no Mary Sues. Shuri is a Mary Sue character. Captain Marvel will probably be a Mary Sue character too..
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Post by DC-Fan on Nov 11, 2018 17:46:16 GMT
An explanation was already given for the characters in the movie to explain why Killmonger was who he was And that explanation was only given to the audience. Sure, the audience knows all about Killmonger having been born and raised in the US and kept a secret from T'Chaka and the rest of his family and the audience knows all about Killmonger finding his father's dead body, left behind by T'Chaka after T'Chaka murdered him. My point is that T'Challa and everyone else in Wakanda doesn't know about any of that. So for a supposedly technologically advanced country to accept Kilmonger's claim of royal heritage without any scientific proof, such as a DNA test, is just dumb and lazy writing. And no, having possession of a ring or a tattoo isn't scientific proof since anyone could've taken the ring or gotten a tattoo.Because such a character does not exist in the story. Klaue was an actual character that was a part of the movie. Your "friend" character is your own creation that does not apply to the movie or any of the characters within it. Even if he did, N'Jobu told Klaue because of his own desires, not because he was his friend or because he cared for him. He personally wanted Wakanda brought down, so he hired a criminal to help him achieve what his goal. Not like Killmonger telling a non existent character about Wakanda because he wanted to because they were close. You claim it's made up and nonexistent. But the movie clearly said that Killmonger was a former Special Forces guy. So we're supposed to believe that he had no friends at all in Special Forces? That's hard to believe since Special Forces team members usually bond very closely due to the fact that their missions are so dangerous and they need to be able to trust their team members have their back.
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Post by DC-Fan on Nov 11, 2018 17:49:11 GMT
is not actually silly or a flimsy explanation. xmen first class, did the hard work to make studying a thing. it also shows mcu movies have poor thin screenplays. check out xmen first class. xavier at oxford
see this is why xmen movies are superior. they are realistic and grounded and have depth. we see xavier in oxford, studying. DOFP heavily implied he was a doctor because Trask reads his paper on genetics and takes it to the usa and russia government warning them of the threat mutants are.
goodness, only mcu fans will try to spin universities as silly makes sense your movies appeals to the brainless masses.
black panther is a generic movie compared to first class, ofcourse you will never see shuri actually studying or in uni or writing academic essays like xavier did.
Uhuh. And what kind of Oxford degree does Xavier have that explains how he got the knowledge to build Cerebro? Or are you implying that every Oxford graduate just happens to have the knowledge to build something that complex? 1st, Xavier is a Professor. That means he's more than just an Oxford graduate. He has a post-graduate degree. 2nd, Xavier is also 1 of the most powerful mutant telepaths in the world.
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Post by DC-Fan on Nov 11, 2018 17:50:25 GMT
Apparently, it is you who can not consider a black women capable of such status without a long explaination as to how she achieved the genius level intellect depicted by Shuri in BP. That’s your hang up. Don’t try to shed it off on others. No one is saying that though. Black Panther excessively and shamelessly uses the race card throughout the movie so it's no surprise that an MCU fan would try to use the race card here.
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Post by DC-Fan on Nov 11, 2018 17:52:48 GMT
Vibranium is an element/alloy like any other traditional metal and needs experts in diagnostics in metallurgy chemistry to characterise and manipulate it. Wakanda would need a lot of inorganic analytical machinery to control vibranium. Sure they can just buy these from abroad, but would require experts to operate. One decent explanation I read was that some Wakandans would go abroad and study in foreign universities to relay the information back to Wakanda when they came home, siphoning the knowledge. That would make good sense. So Shuri may have been home schooled by one of these people. I wish they would drop a line in the film to suggest that, like they have with other comic book genuises like Stark and Banner. So again I ask, why would she need to go abroad for studies when it's clear they had more knowledge back home (at least in regards to what she was shown to be good at)? And I ask again, how the fuck does Shuri not only become an expert at metallurgy chemistry but also an expert at human physiology to know exactly what was wrong with Ross and how to heal his wounds when other doctors couldn't do it? The answer: Because Shuri is a Mary Sue character.
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Post by DC-Fan on Nov 11, 2018 18:00:44 GMT
The experts would have to have acquired their knowledge from somewhere outside Africa. To handle and manipulate a rare metal like Vibranium needs high level expertise. Before the asteroid hit Wakanda, we can assume it was like any other heartland African country - poor and underdeveloped. Not a place where world leading experts in chemistry reside. Well think what would likely happen in real life today. A new metallic elememt is found is South Sudan. You can bet that American/Europeon/Japanese chemists would be called to invesitgate, analyse and study the newly found metal. The tribes who originally found the metal centuries ago is odd. The film doesnt really expand on how they went from primitive society to technically advanced one whilst keeping the Wakandan state secret. Vibranium in that sense is depicted as some sort of unknown magical entity that can cure disease, levitate objects, absorb and redistribute energy etc. Its not simple as adamantium which is basically only used to fortify other existing structures. Back in the iron age of earth, theres only so much you could do with iron. Nowadays with technology you can do a lot more. Early Wakandans who found vibranium should have been limited in what they could do because technology wasnt around for them to advance the metals functionality. The whole point is that Wakanda is a secret state. You cant develop to that level of technology if you dont collaborate internationally. Its not possible. The person who taught shuri must have gained knowledge from outside of Wakanda. Unless you are claiming Wakanda invented every single piece of metallurgy analytical techniques to ever exist so there would be no need to go to the outside world. Tell me, how would Wakandans know how to build a scanning electron microscope to study surface defects of Vibranium? Unless they invented it (in which case theyd have to have built every single piece of metallurgy analytical devices that ever have existed) then someone from Wakanda must have travelled outside to gain that knowledge and bring it back. A million years ago, there was no human on earth who had knowledge about machinery. When the Wakandans first found the vibranium, there was no one else to ask. It's almost like you're saying that these wakandans were incapable of developing stuff on their own. No, they didn't need the help of other nations when they were already the most advanced nation around. Remember that China developed advanced metallurgy way before North America did, so it's not like they needed to cross study with them. Now did modern day Wakandans study outside for further knowledge? Sure, why not? That still doesn't change the fact that they're far more advanced than other countries and Shuri would have no need to study in an outside university for her knowledge. When you're already in the most advanced country in the world, why bother studying somewhere else? Thanks for proving how bad the writing in Black Panther is. It's impossible for Wakanda (or any country) to develop expertise on vibranium or any element not from Earth without extensive research and testing. And extensive research and testing requires lots of scientific equipment and labs. And scientific equipment and labs require lots of money to acquire or build. Money that an African country like Wakanda wouldn't have had. So NO, it's IMPOSSIBLE for Wakanda to become experts on vibranium without any help from other countries. This is just another example of bad writing in MCU movies.
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Post by damngumby on Nov 11, 2018 18:01:29 GMT
Of course the “real science hypothesis that has depth” can not possibly explain the wide variety of fantastical (and often ridiculous) charactors depicted in X-men. Anyone who thinks the X-men is based on “real science” must be completely daft in the head. ![](https://media1.tenor.com/images/396b7424a498cc0154ea9270a056a715/tenor.gif) I said Science hypothesis like another standard good science fiction series like say maybe star trek. yikes...once again mcu fans show their stupidity. ![](https://s26.postimg.cc/tek3suwt5/laugh.gif) Oh dear ... someone thinks Star Trek technobabble is real science with depth! Silly comic book superhero fan.
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Post by damngumby on Nov 11, 2018 18:19:49 GMT
Apparently, it is you who can not consider a black women capable of such status without a long explaination as to how she achieved the genius level intellect depicted by Shuri in BP. That’s your hang up. Don’t try to shed it off on others. No one is saying that though. Is not the Oxford argument about the X-men laying the ground work for Xavier’s super genius status and BP not offering the same “depth” with the Shuri character? Of course, it took a reboot of the X-men series before they got around to exploring Xavier’s past.
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Post by ThatGuy on Nov 11, 2018 18:27:15 GMT
black widow is the same character, she is an action figure. they tried to give her something in age of ultron and it was awful so they dropped it. any sane person will take the tragic romance of bruce and talia over black widow/banner and age of ultron.
shuri is a mary sue, she has no flaws also didn't the actress once say she is smarter than stark? like rey knows the millennium falcon better than han solo. geez, no wonder star wars fans hate disney star wars, it is like mcu movies
wanda is useless. all she does is show up for cgi scenes, though I can fault wanda much, the only time she ever has depth as a character is when she is featured in xmen stories like house of m or xmen evolution. you have no idea what a Mary Sue is. He only knows that it's a derogative term for a female character.
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