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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 3:55:40 GMT
I’m pretty sure the implication is that once she finally came to terms with everything, she was able to gain full control of her powers. In any case, she definitely became more powerful than she was before. That's pretty weak man.
Oh' she's magically stronger because reasons, but let's have her beat him with lightening instead of using her, ya know, strength we just gave her.
Remember when I said the narrative was terrible. There ya go
Kind of like how Thor magically learned how to use lightning without his hammer? Thats is pretty weak man. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 14, 2017 3:58:21 GMT
That's pretty weak man.
Oh' she's magically stronger because reasons, but let's have her beat him with lightening instead of using her, ya know, strength we just gave her.
Remember when I said the narrative was terrible. There ya go
Kind of like how Thor magically learned how to use lightning without his hammer? Thats is pretty weak man. Actually he never needed his hammer.
But you're still not answering why even if she is stronger, that they choose to have her beat him with lightening. You've already said that's just for show.
The point is, the narrative structure of this fight doesn't depict what you're explaining it to be.
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:03:47 GMT
Kind of like how Thor magically learned how to use lightning without his hammer? Thats is pretty weak man. Actually he never needed his hammer.
But you're still not answering why even if she is stronger, that they choose to have her beat him with lightening. You've already said that's just for show.
The point is, the narrative structure of this fight doesn't depict what you're explaining it to be.
It was established that he needed the hammer to channel his powers, but his ability to use lightning without the hammer still kind of just showed up. For the record, Im not using this to criticize the movie, but WW learning how to use her powers is no more of a poor narrative decision than Thor learning how to use his. Also, I’ve already said that apart from being flashy, WW killing Ares ipwith lightning was likely done to demonstrate what Diana can do. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 14, 2017 4:06:53 GMT
Actually, no she didn't. If Ares hadn't fired that lightning, she wouldn't have defeated him. So how was she able to telekentically knock him back? For that matter, how was she able to absorb his lightning and fire it back at him if she was no match for him? also, I thought your argument was that Diana was too perfect? Now it’s that she couldn’t defeat Ares? Which is it? I'm talking character wise, not power wise, when I say she was portrayed too "perfect" (but then again, this is a problem with a LOT of DC characters). So she was able to push him a little, so what? Ares apparently killed off the entire Olympian Pantheon and they were stronger than Steppenwolf who was stronger than Diana. How was she able to absorb the Lightning and fire it back? Thanks to her magic bracelets that apparently can do anything for her. Instead of her having to put any real effort in. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:09:02 GMT
So how was she able to telekentically knock him back? For that matter, how was she able to absorb his lightning and fire it back at him if she was no match for him? also, I thought your argument was that Diana was too perfect? Now it’s that she couldn’t defeat Ares? Which is it? I'm talking character wise, not power wise, when I say she was portrayed too "perfect" (but then again, this is a problem with a LOT of DC characters). So she was able to push him a little, so what? Ares apparently killed off the entire Olympian Pantheon and they were stronger than Steppenwolf who was stronger than Diana. How was she able to absorb the Lightning and fire it back? Thanks to her magic bracelets that apparently can do anything for her. Instead of her having to put any real effort in. She didn’t push him “a little” she pushed him back without even touching him. Also, the Gods were never established as being individually stronger than Steppenwolf. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 14, 2017 4:10:34 GMT
It was established that he needed the hammer to channel his powers, Mjolnir inhibited Thor's power all along, it was never the source of it. It actually made him weak. He always had that kind of power, Odin gave him the Hammer to keep him from realizing it before he thought he was ready to know. What she does is rely on her enemies to kill themselves for her. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 14, 2017 4:12:41 GMT
I'm talking character wise, not power wise, when I say she was portrayed too "perfect" (but then again, this is a problem with a LOT of DC characters). So she was able to push him a little, so what? Ares apparently killed off the entire Olympian Pantheon and they were stronger than Steppenwolf who was stronger than Diana. How was she able to absorb the Lightning and fire it back? Thanks to her magic bracelets that apparently can do anything for her. Instead of her having to put any real effort in. She didn’t push him “a little” she pushed him back without even touching him. Also, the Gods were never established as being individually stronger than Steppenwolf. That still doesn't mean much. I seriously doubt pushing means much to someone who killed off the entire Olympian Pantheon. Zeus' lightning was enough to stop Steppenwolf before all on its own. And Steppenwolf was stronger than Diana...yet somehow the lightning that stopped him couldn't harm her? Sorry, that's inconsistent writing. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:13:24 GMT
It was established that he needed the hammer to channel his powers, Mjolnir inhibited Thor's power all along, it was never the source of it. It actually made him weak. He always had that kind of power, Odin gave him the Hammer to keep him from realizing it before he thought he was ready to know. What she does is rely on her enemies to kill themselves for her. I never claimed it was the source of his power. I said it was used to channel his power. No, she doesn’t rely on Ares to kill himself. She kills him through her superior strength. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 14, 2017 4:13:30 GMT
Actually he never needed his hammer.
But you're still not answering why even if she is stronger, that they choose to have her beat him with lightening. You've already said that's just for show.
The point is, the narrative structure of this fight doesn't depict what you're explaining it to be.
It was established that he needed the hammer to channel his powers, but his ability to use lightning without the hammer still kind of just showed up. For the record, Im not using this to criticize the movie, but WW learning how to use her powers is no more of a poor narrative decision than Thor learning how to use his. Also, I’ve already said that apart from being flashy, WW killing Ares ipwith lightning was likely done to demonstrate what Diana can do. You're really not seeing the difference are you? Did Thor learn how to use this power in the last minute of the final battle, or was it slowly developed over the course of the whole movie?
What it demonstrated for Diana is instead of showing how strong she spontaneously was, or taking some time to narrate her growth or highlight what had happened, within 5 seconds they chose to use Ares lightening instead of the power she supposedly has, and somehow she knew this would kill him even though he was just controlling it.
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:14:48 GMT
She didn’t push him “a little” she pushed him back without even touching him. Also, the Gods were never established as being individually stronger than Steppenwolf. That still doesn't mean much. I seriously doubt pushing means much to someone who killed off the entire Olympian Pantheon. Zeus' lightning was enough to stop Steppenwolf before all on its own. And Steppenwolf was stronger than Diana...yet somehow the lightning that stopped him couldn't harm her? Sorry, that's inconsistent writing. Zeus wasn’t fighting Steppenwolf “all on his own”. He had the help of the other Olympians, Atlanteans, and the Green Lantern Corps. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 14, 2017 4:15:39 GMT
Mjolnir inhibited Thor's power all along, it was never the source of it. It actually made him weak. He always had that kind of power, Odin gave him the Hammer to keep him from realizing it before he thought he was ready to know. What she does is rely on her enemies to kill themselves for her. No, she doesn’t rely on Ares to kill himself. She kills him through her superior strength. She doesn't do anything that actually hurts him, he fires a weapon that get reflected back at him. It's no different than how the Green Goblin killed himself with his own glider. |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 14, 2017 4:16:30 GMT
That still doesn't mean much. I seriously doubt pushing means much to someone who killed off the entire Olympian Pantheon. Zeus' lightning was enough to stop Steppenwolf before all on its own. And Steppenwolf was stronger than Diana...yet somehow the lightning that stopped him couldn't harm her? Sorry, that's inconsistent writing. Zeus wasn’t fighting Steppenwolf “all on his own”. He had the help of the other Olympians, Atlanteans, and the Green Lantern Corps. The Atlanteans and the Green Lantern did absolutely nothing to Steppenwolf, nor did the other Olympians' attacks. Only Zeus' lightning did anything in that flashback. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:17:23 GMT
It was established that he needed the hammer to channel his powers, but his ability to use lightning without the hammer still kind of just showed up. For the record, Im not using this to criticize the movie, but WW learning how to use her powers is no more of a poor narrative decision than Thor learning how to use his. Also, I’ve already said that apart from being flashy, WW killing Ares ipwith lightning was likely done to demonstrate what Diana can do. You're really not seeing the difference are you? Did Thor learn how to use this power in the last minute of the final battle, or was it slowly developed over the course of the whole movie?
What it demonstrated for Diana is instead of showing how strong she spontaneously was, or taking some time to narrate her growth or highlight what had happened, within 5 seconds they chose to use Ares lightening instead of the power she supposedly has, and somehow she knew this would kill him even though he was just controlling it.
Diana’s powers were slowly developing over the course of her movie as well. Remember that scene early on when she accidentally caused a shockwave that injured Antiope? |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:19:20 GMT
Zeus wasn’t fighting Steppenwolf “all on his own”. He had the help of the other Olympians, Atlanteans, and the Green Lantern Corps. The Atlanteans and the Green Lantern did absolutely nothing to Steppenwolf, nor did the other Olympians' attacks. Only Zeus' lightning did anything in that flashback. We didn’t see the entire battle in the flashback. We only saw bits and pieces. It was very clearly established that the entire Earth’s forces was needed to fight off Steppenwolf. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 14, 2017 4:33:41 GMT
You're really not seeing the difference are you? Did Thor learn how to use this power in the last minute of the final battle, or was it slowly developed over the course of the whole movie?
What it demonstrated for Diana is instead of showing how strong she spontaneously was, or taking some time to narrate her growth or highlight what had happened, within 5 seconds they chose to use Ares lightening instead of the power she supposedly has, and somehow she knew this would kill him even though he was just controlling it.
Diana’s powers were slowly developing over the course of her movie as well. Remember that scene early on when she accidentally caused a shockwave that injured Antiope? Is that supposed to be comparable to the obvious surge of energy in Thor throughout the entire film, Grandmaster's references to it, his use of the power against the Hulk or Odin's speech to him? Because Diana's just shows up at the end.
You're really trying hard to make all this sound like it works, but it doesn't.
Ares has random powers like appearing in windows that never has anything to do with anything, Diana DBZ power ups and gets one knock back in before we're supposed to buy that she's unbeatable and then the writers decide not to have her use her power but to use Ares.
You're at the same step 1 we were at this morning.
Are we done now?
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Post by thisguy4000 on Dec 14, 2017 4:36:17 GMT
Diana’s powers were slowly developing over the course of her movie as well. Remember that scene early on when she accidentally caused a shockwave that injured Antiope? Is that supposed to be comparable to the obvious surge of energy in Thor throughout the entire film, Grandmaster's references to it, his use of the power against the Hulk or Odin's speech to him? Because Diana's just shows up at the end.
You're really trying hard to make all this sound like it works, but it doesn't.
Ares has random powers like appearing in windows that never has anything to do with anything, Diana DBZ power ups and gets one knock back in before we're supposed to buy that she's unbeatable and then the writers decide not to have her use her power but to use Ares.
You're at the same step 1 we were at this morning.
Are we done now?
Diana’s powers didn’t come out of nowhere is my point. Her powers were already hinted at from the beginning, and the scene where she injured Antiope was meant to show that she couldn’t control her powers yet. By the time she came to terms with Steve’s sacrifice, she finally did gain control over them. That was the point. Are we done now? |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Dec 14, 2017 4:38:24 GMT
Is that supposed to be comparable to the obvious surge of energy in Thor throughout the entire film, Grandmaster's references to it, his use of the power against the Hulk or Odin's speech to him? Because Diana's just shows up at the end.
You're really trying hard to make all this sound like it works, but it doesn't.
Ares has random powers like appearing in windows that never has anything to do with anything, Diana DBZ power ups and gets one knock back in before we're supposed to buy that she's unbeatable and then the writers decide not to have her use her power but to use Ares.
You're at the same step 1 we were at this morning.
Are we done now?
Diana’s powers didn’t come out of nowhere is my point. Her powers were already hinted at from the beginning, and the scene where she injured Antiope was meant to show that she couldn’t control her powers yet. By the time she came to terms with Steve’s sacrifice, she finally did gain control over them. That was the point. Are we done now? yeah we're done. The movie did a bad job of setting up that narrative. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2017 12:21:05 GMT
Thanks for bringing me up to speed. I've personally become a little fatigued by Batman's overwhelming popularity. I hope the fans get what they're looking for as far as the Bat-Family is concerned. I think the Batgirl film is going to turn out better than Wonder Woman. I've always thought she was a more credible character with an easier to follow history.
Yeah. You are right. Batman has been overused but the thing that has been overused the most is his early years which is why I am glad they decided to go with an older Batman this time instead of rebooting for the 100th time 'cause it finally gives them the chance to focus on the Bat Family and use some of his villains that couldn't be used in the Nolan movies. I would like it if they made direct adaptions of 'Batman: Detective Comics Rebirth', 'Batman: Eternal', 'Batman and Robin: Eternal' 'Batman: Death of the Family', 'Batman End Game' and 'Batman: Court of Owls' to name a few from his later years. 'Batman: Detective Comics Rebirth' has by far been one of my favourite comic book series this year next to the newest series of 'Witchblade' (which just had the first issue sell out), Hack/Slash, Red Sonja, Fathom, Monstress, Sunstone, Vampirella, Nightwing, The Magdalena, SpiderGwen, Belladonna, Sheena: Queen of the Jungle, Batwoman, Batgirl and Birds of Prey, Batwoman, Rat Queens, Saga and The Ravening and the Spoiler and Clayface have been stealing the show and I never thought they would make Clayface into a hero let alone a member of the Bat Family but I think it was a great idea and he is a very interesting character and I would like to see that played out in the moments. The Spoiler is my second favourite member of the Bat Family below Batgirl.
With the 'Batgirl' movie being based on Gail Simone's 'Batgirl' series which is one of the best comic book series I have read in the past 30 years I think it does have a good chance of outdoing 'Wonder Woman' and becoming the biggest female superhero movie of all time and Joss has proven he can be successful with female superheroes with 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer.' I also think movies of 'Birds of Prey' and 'Supergirl/ Linda Danvers', could top 'Wonder Woman' too with the right writers.  |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2017 12:24:48 GMT
Not exactly. With Geoff Johns role being upgraded now things are expected to change and there is going to be a big shakeup. Various news sites have reported and DC themselves. Geoff could even be writing some of the movies himself.  And yet they're still continuing with the same continuity. Why would anybody show up for Justice League Dark when they've already given up on Justice League?
According to multiple sites 'The Batman' and the 'Bat Universe' will be based after 'Justice League' but won't be set in the same universe which is the right way to go since the Bat Universe is big enough to not need the other superheroes in it and 'Green Arrow' can easily tie into the Bat Universe with his connection to 'Birds of Prey' through the Black Canary.  |
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Post by formersamhmd on Dec 14, 2017 12:35:51 GMT
The Atlanteans and the Green Lantern did absolutely nothing to Steppenwolf, nor did the other Olympians' attacks. Only Zeus' lightning did anything in that flashback. We didn’t see the entire battle in the flashback. We only saw bits and pieces. It was very clearly established that the entire Earth’s forces was needed to fight off Steppenwolf. They didn't do a good job showing it then. |
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