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Post by damngumby on Jul 5, 2019 17:54:20 GMT
he literally just keeps saying the rules aren't what the dialogue establishes.
And of course movie characters never lie. So we should believe Beck's dialogue that he comes from another Earth that was destroyed by a fire monster! In order for DC-Fan to be correct about time travel in the MCU, all the characters have to be lying and the events in the movie have to be incorrect. I think that deserves an A for stupidity. 
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Post by damngumby on Jul 5, 2019 14:50:33 GMT
Leave it to the MCU to get Peter Parker/Spider-Man just right.  Leave it to MCU to fuck it all up and give the world the worst Peter Parker / Spider-Man ever. What are you talking about? According to this link of yours, Spiderman Homecoming is among the top ten best superhero movie of all times! That's way better that the other five SM movies, at #24, 29, 49, 65, (off the chart bad). And no doubt Spiderman Far From Home will swing into your list somewhere in the top 10-20. That is total domination by the MCU Spiderman movies, just like Tom Holland totally dominates the best Spiderman polls. So, all you are left with is your own personal opinion. The same personal opinion that said BvS and Justice league are among the greatest superhero movies ever made. Oh brother! ... That's still funny!
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Post by damngumby on Jul 4, 2019 15:09:57 GMT
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Post by damngumby on Jul 4, 2019 7:48:22 GMT
Spam alert!
Oh dear ... it looks like DC-Fan is becoming even more unhinged than usual ... with a flurry of long incoherent posts that just repeat the same incorrect things from his previous posts.
Perhaps the mods should issue the poor guy a time out before he hurts himself. He's certainly demonstrated (again) that he is incapable of participating in a discussion in any constructive way once his argument has been shown to be completely wrong.
What we've got going on here is just a temper tantrum.
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Post by damngumby on Jul 3, 2019 22:16:58 GMT
WRONG AGAIN!!! The only bullshit is the bullshit that was written by the Endgame writers. Basically, the Endgame writers are too stupid to understand that time travel isn't linear or sequential. The Endgame writers are one up on you, cupcake (as are we all). They understand that time travel isn't really a thing ... and you can create your own rules to propel your story. The beauty of the MCU time travel rules is that it avoids the typical time travel paradox that plagues most other time travel stories. So stop stamping your feet and insisting that the MCU must follow the time travel rules from other movies. One of the reasons the MCU is so spectacularly successful is that they don't prescribe to the things you want. If they did then we'd have another BvS or Justice League on our hands ... and dear lord, no one wants that!
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Post by damngumby on Jul 3, 2019 9:37:05 GMT
Now in the movies some dialog may actually confirm this, or flashback footage from pre 9/11 showing the towers may also strongly imply 9/11 happened but unless something is stated about 9/11, the attack or the towers being destroyed even proof there was 2 towers only implies, not confirms. I think the implication is already pretty strong that 9/11 happened in the MCU original timeline. Not that it matters in the context of this thread. In the MCU you can not change the past of a timeline. Full stop. End of discussion. Thanks for playing. It is also highly doubtful that 9/11 happened in the alternate timeline, considering how random events would have started altering that timeline the moment it was created. Maybe Middle East unrest and a hatred for America (something that would have been too ingrained to just randomly eliminate) resulted in a similar attack on US soil at some point, but it almost certainly would have differed in execution and timing ... making it impossible to anticipate and prevent. The question of the OP has been asked and answered. What else is there to discuss?
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Post by damngumby on Jul 2, 2019 21:17:08 GMT
Why else would the United States be fighting in Afghanistan if not for 9/11? It's a fair assumption that the MCU follows American history up until at least 2008. I'm pretty sure 9/11 happened in the original timeline. I don't recall seeing the World Trade Center during The Avengers Battle of New York.
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Post by damngumby on Jul 2, 2019 20:52:33 GMT
Because it would have been impossible. In the MCU, you can not change the past of a timeline, you can only cause a new timeline to branch off from the original timeline. They were pretty clear about that in the movie. BTTF rules (or Star Trek) do not apply. Period. Anyone who does not understand that should refrain from commenting on this topic ... unless your intention is to waste your time looking like an idiot.
Steve Rogers marrying Peggy Carter created a branching timeline with it's own indeterminate future. A future that in all likelihood immediately started to deviated from the event that already occurred in the original timeline. In other words, there is no way of knowing if 9/11 even occured in the new timeline. ... so the OP question is completely pointless. Good going ace!
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Post by damngumby on Jun 30, 2019 18:17:49 GMT
So, it appears that we have an unanimous decision!
DC-Fan is wrong.
He has failed to comprehend the MCU time travel rules and he has repeatedly misapplied other rules from other movies.
As to why he is so wrong, well, it looks like we have a split decision on that one. Liar or retard ... you decide.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 30, 2019 14:48:38 GMT
In the MCU, you can not travel to the future of any particular timeline. It doesn't exist. wrong!!! Yes, you can travel to the future. Marty traveled from 1985 to 2015. You must be fucking retarded. How many times have you been told that Marty doesn't exist in the MCU. The BTTF time travel rules do not apply to the MCU. Thanos 2 traveled to 2023 of the original timeline. There was no 2023 in his own timeline yet. The present moment of that timeline was 2014 and it's future was undetermined. The present moment of the original timeline was 2023 and it's future was undetermined. Sorry, cupcake. You've got it all completely wrong ... and you've dug yourself a deep enough hole that you can never get out, even if the fog were to suddenly lift from your mind. I gave it the ol' college try ... tried to explain it to you using small words ... but you are as dense as I knew you to be. Have fun fuming that the MCU makes no sense to everyone who completely understands it. We have a place for guys like you - on the short bus.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 30, 2019 11:10:55 GMT
If you don't like BTTF, we can look at another example. In The City of the Edge of Forever, McCoy goes back in time and saves Edith Keeler from dying in a traffic accident. Edith Keeler then goes on to lead a peace movement that delays the US from entering WW2 and allows the Nazis to develop the atomic bomb first and win the war. If Kirk stops McCoy from saving Edith Keeler, then Edith Keeler dies and the original timeline is restored. But if Kirk doesn't stop McCoy from saving Edith Keeler, then Edith Keeler lives AND millions of people would've died. So McCoy changing the original timeline not only changes Edith Keeler's future but also changes the future for millions of people. It's not a million separate timelines, one for each individual, in which the Nazis win the war. It's just 1 timeline, in which millions of people's futures are changed by the Nazis winning the war. If one were to apply the MCU time travel rules to that Star Trek episode, then McCoy would have created a new timeline when he went back in time and saved Edith Keeler. The original timeline would have been unaltered (the original Edith Keeler would still be road kill) and the Star Trek crew would have no idea that anything had happened. (There would be just two timelines, not millions.) This avoids the paradoxical (and nonsensical) nature of being able to travel back in time and change the past of your own timeline. No, the Endgame writers were using a different set of rules. Like different sci-fi movies use different rules of space travel (warp drive, wormholes, hyperspace, sub-light ... etc.) There is absolutely no problem with any of that, because ... fiction.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 30, 2019 9:53:21 GMT
And the thing is, you can't travel to the future. The future hasn't happen yet and doesn't exist. You can only travel back to an anchor point. Yes, you can travel to the future. Marty traveled from 1985 to 2015. Even the Avengers traveled to the future in Endgame. They traveled to the past to retrieve the stones. Then they traveled to the future (2023) with the stones. And past Thanos also traveled to the future (2023). In the MCU, you can not travel to the future of any particular timeline. It doesn't exist. It should be obvious that the MCU universe has multiple timelines. Each timeline consists of an unalterable past, a present moment (the point in time in which events occur) that is advancing through time at the same rate as the other timelines, and it's own indeterminate future that has yet to exist. That's it. Simple! The Avengers never traveled beyond the present moment of the original timeline. They traveled to the past, created some new timelines, and then traveled back to the present moment of the original timeline. Past Thanos never travel to the future of the timeline in which he was created. He couldn't. It didn't exist. He traveled to the present moment of the original timeline. Once there, he was defeated. There is no way he could have known about his defeat prior to it actually occurring. Nebular's memories would not extend into a future that hadn't happened yet. BTW, every time you evoke a different movie, with different time travel rules, you lose the argument. And, oh boy, you've been doing a lot of losing in this thread!
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Post by damngumby on Jun 30, 2019 0:55:26 GMT
Over.
The MCU has reached a point where even an average movie about a not well known character (Captain Marvel) can surpass one billion dollars. Spiderman: Far from Home has much more going for it.
Spiderman, himself. Arguably the most popular superhero who hasn't been severely damaged by the recent DC dumpster fire, like Batman and Superman. People love the Tom Holland Spiderman!
Great reviews. Currently sitting at 91% on RT. We know going in that it will be a top notch movie.
A sort of sequel to the massively successful Endgame. The ramifications of Endgame left us with an intriguing aftermath in the MCU universe. Audiences will want to know how our favorite characters deal with this new world.
Spiderman: Homecoming is considered to be the best of all the live action Spiderman movies. It made nearly $900 million. Far from Home will build upon that success and cruise past one billion, easily.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 29, 2019 20:07:03 GMT
There is no someone in the future. By definition, the future is something that has not occurred yet. It is unoccupied. WRONG AGAIN!!! If there was no future, then past Nebula wouldn't have been able to access 2023 Nebula's memories because 2023 Nebula wouldn't exist from past Nebula's perspective. You're still looking at it form a linear point of view. But time travel doesn't follow a linear, sequential path. The whole point of time travel is that someone can jump to any point in time (past or future) in any random order. That's why 1985 Marty can travel to 2015 (and skip over 30 years) without having to wait for 1986 through 2014 to happen. Because time travel doesn't follow a linear, sequential path. That's also why Strange's so-called "winning" scenario also isn't a winning scenario but actually a losing scenario. Because past Nebula can access future Nebula's memories at any point in time without having to wait an hour for the end of the movie and thus past Nebula already knows that Thanos and his entire army would be defeated in 2023. So Thanos would also know that and thus Thanos wouldn't travel with his entire army to 2023 and instead would simply just travel to 2018 and kill Tony Stark right after Strange gave Thanos the time stone in 2018. That's a HUGE PLOTHOLE in Endgame! You still don't get it. "Nebular 2" came into existence at the moment her timeline was created. She wasn't accessing the memories of another Nebular from the future of the N2 timeline. The future in the N2 timeline had not happened yet, there was no one there. She was accessing the memories of a Nebular from an entirely different timeline. You're still looking at this from a Back to the Future point of view, which is why you are constantly wrong. The movie specifically said it does not follow those rules. Nebular 2 could not access memories from a Nebular 1 about events that had yet to occur in the N1 timeline. If N2 Thanos were to travel to N1 2018 and kill Tony Stark, he wouldn't stop what was happening in N1, he would just splinter off a new timeline. N1 Tony Stark would be unaffected. Thanos had to travel to the N1 timeline present day in order to affect what was happening in the N1 timeline. In the MCU every timeline has it's own undetermined future. That is why this thread of yours is such an epic FAIL!
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Post by damngumby on Jun 29, 2019 6:17:02 GMT
Banner never said you can't change the future. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers. There is no someone in the future. By definition, the future is something that has not occurred yet. It is unoccupied. In the MCU, if you travel to the past, you kick off a new timeline with it's own indeterminate future, a future that has not occurred yet. You are not a time traveler from the future of the new timeline, you are a time traveler from the original timeline. If you wish to return to the original timeline, you must return to it's present. If you return to any point in it's past, you will find yourself in yet another (newly created) timeline where everyone (again) has the free will to shape the future of that particular timeline. Therefore, nothing is predetermined in the MCU ... you are 100% wrong ... and the blame is wholly on you. Congratulations, champ.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 29, 2019 2:45:53 GMT
No, Banner clearly confirmed when the said that they can't change the past that the future is pre-determined and set in stone and thus no one in MCU has any free will to choose a different path. Because the future is already the past for someone in the distant future. It's such a simple concept that it's simply astonishing that so many MCU fans still don't understand that simple concept. There was no someone from the future or distant future in Infinity War/Endgame. Any moment in time beyond the present day has yet to occur and therefore does not exist. Travel to the past does not change what has already occurred, instead it creates a new timeline with it's own present day and undetermined future. I'm pretty sure that was explained in the movie. Because of this, there is actually endless opportunities to exercise free will in the MCU, depending on how much time traveling is going on. MCU : free will. DCEU : fixed destiny.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 28, 2019 23:03:28 GMT
Liar. Banner never confirmed it. Yes, he did. If Banner "confirmed" that the future was unalterable, then he wouldn't have made any effort to alter the outcome of Endgame ... since it was going to happen in a predetermined way, no matter what he did. He did make an effort, therefore he was aware that the future was not set. I bet a 5th grader can grasp that. Why can't you? MCU - the future is not predetermined. DCEU - the future is predetermined via destiny. Don't blame me if you don't like this inevitable conclusion. Blame yourself.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 28, 2019 22:54:17 GMT
And even then neither of those two movies are bad. Both are awful. "Batman v Superman is one of the greatest superhero movies ever made!" DC-Fan.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 28, 2019 9:58:38 GMT
If you didn't make anything up then go ahead and quote exactly what Banner said where he supposedly claimed that futures were predetermined.
So I'm just going to repeat myself until I become enough of an irritant that a mod steps in and locks this thread. I think we're done here.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 27, 2019 23:46:04 GMT
It's amusing that DC-Fraud has to try and concoct a convoluted and unconvincing explanation why the future in the MCU is predetermined ... after he already presented a simple and straightforward reason why the DCEU future is predetermined.
Just wind him up, and watch him shred himself to pieces. LOL!
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