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Post by ThatGuy on Jun 27, 2019 8:53:54 GMT
Yes, he does say it. You've just confirmed with that video. Banner says "Changing the past doesn't change the future." Well, for someone in 2028 or 2033 or later, 2023 IS the past. So according to Banner, 2023 can't be changed and thus 2023 is already pre-determined and set in stone. So I didn't make it up. According to Banner (and the Endgame writers) and the video that you've posted, EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone so no one has any free will to change their path in MCU. Thanks for proving that I'm correct once again. And like I said before, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, take it up witht eh Endgame writers. Sorry, but I just proved you wrong you dumb moron. Professor Hulk also says "If you travel to the past, then your past becomes your future, and your former present becomes the past, which can't changed by your new future." That means everybody in the MCU still has a future. You're just creating a new future for yourself by traveling back in time. Basically saying your past doesn't get rewritten on you. It still happened.
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Post by Skaathar on Jun 27, 2019 9:59:56 GMT
If he said it in Endgame then it shouldn't be too hard for you to quote exactly what he said. So come on then, troll. Either quote the exact words of Banner where he claims their future is predetermined or admit that you're a liar making stuff up. I didn't make anything up. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers. Of course you made it up. If it was true you'd have easily quoted what Banner said about predetermined futures by now. So go on then little troll, please quote exactly where Banner said their futures were predetermined.
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Post by Hauntedknight87 on Jun 27, 2019 11:38:25 GMT
Don't know if this was brought up, but how can a universe have a predetermined destiny when one scenario alone had over 14 million outcomes? DC doesn't have branching timelines. They only have 52 different Earths. That's actually a good point.
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Post by poutinep on Jun 27, 2019 14:01:33 GMT
So you're saying that Banner (and the Endgame writers) are wrong AND EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and there's no free will in MCU? Only 1 of those 2 possibilities can be true and the other isn't true. Regardless of which 1 of those 2 possibilities is true, the principle that must apply is that the same rules have to apply to past, present, and future since the present and future are just the past for someone in the far future. Free will does not exist - not in movies, not in real life. Every choice you'll ever make has already been made. You're just along for the ride.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 27, 2019 17:08:49 GMT
Yes, he does say it. You've just confirmed with that video. Banner says "Changing the past doesn't change the future." Well, for someone in 2028 or 2033 or later, 2023 IS the past. So according to Banner, 2023 can't be changed and thus 2023 is already pre-determined and set in stone. So I didn't make it up. According to Banner (and the Endgame writers) and the video that you've posted, EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone so no one has any free will to change their path in MCU. Thanks for proving that I'm correct once again. And like I said before, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, take it up witht eh Endgame writers. Sorry, but I just proved you wrong you dumb moron. Professor Hulk also says "If you travel to the past, then your past becomes your future, and your former present becomes the past, which can't changed by your new future." That means everybody in the MCU still has a future. You're just creating a new future for yourself by traveling back in time. No, you've haven't prove anything except that I'm 100% correct. Also, what "Professor Hulk" is stupid and makes no sense at all. "Your past becomes your future". LOL!!! That is the stupidest comment ever. The past and future are opposite directions so No, the past doesn't become the future. Just another example of how the Endgame writers don't understand the concept of time at all.
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Post by justanaveragejoe on Jun 27, 2019 17:16:24 GMT
Sorry, but I just proved you wrong you dumb moron. Professor Hulk also says "If you travel to the past, then your past becomes your future, and your former present becomes the past, which can't changed by your new future." That means everybody in the MCU still has a future. You're just creating a new future for yourself by traveling back in time. No, you've haven't prove anything except that I'm 100% correct. Also, what "Professor Hulk" is stupid and makes no sense at all. "Your past becomes your future". LOL!!! That is the stupidest comment ever. The past and future are opposite directions so No, the past doesn't become the future. Just another example of how the Endgame writers don't understand the concept of time at all. Yes, the past becomes your future. I mean think about it: Your present self is thinking about traveling to the past with a time machine, therefore your future self will be traveling back in time to the past.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 27, 2019 17:18:24 GMT
Sorry, but I just proved you wrong you dumb moron. Professor Hulk also says "If you travel to the past, then your past becomes your future, and your former present becomes the past, which can't changed by your new future." That means everybody in the MCU still has a future. You're just creating a new future for yourself by traveling back in time. Basically saying your past doesn't get rewritten on you. It still happened. 1st, saying "your past becomes your future" is stupid and makes no sense at all. The past and future are opposite directions so No, the past doesn't become the future. 2nd, like I said, if we go by what Banner claims, that you can't change the past, then the same rule has to also apply to the present and the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 and 2033 and beyond. Basically, the Endgame writers and MCU fans are trying to apply 2 separate rules (similar to how Pats fans tried to argue that weather caused the footballs that Brady used to cheat to deflate by arguing that the laws of physics work differently on opposite sides of a football field and thus caused the Pats footballs to deflate by a large amount while the Colts footballs on the opposite side of the football field didn't deflate by a large amount). The laws of physics have to work the same on both sides of a football field (and thus the argument by Pats fans that Brady didn't cheat has been proven false). Similarly, the rules of time travel have to work the same for someone in 2023 as they work for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond. So if Banner claims that they can't change the past, then Banner is also saying that they can't change the present or the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond.So EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has the free will to choose a different path. Like I said, I didn't make that up. That's how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about that, take that up with the Endgame writers.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 27, 2019 17:20:17 GMT
I didn't make anything up. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers. Of course you made it up. If it was true you'd have easily quoted what Banner said about predetermined futures by now. So go on then little troll, please quote exactly where Banner said their futures were predetermined. No, I didn't make anything up. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 27, 2019 17:22:14 GMT
Don't know if this was brought up, but how can a universe have a predetermined destiny when one scenario alone had over 14 million outcomes? DC doesn't have branching timelines. They only have 52 different Earths. That's actually a good point. That's why the writing in Endgame is really bad and makes no sense at all. Because everything is inconsistent. Basically, the Endgame writers and MCU fans are trying to apply 2 separate rules (similar to how Pats fans tried to argue that weather caused the footballs that Brady used to cheat to deflate by arguing that the laws of physics work differently on opposite sides of a football field and thus caused the Pats footballs to deflate by a large amount while the Colts footballs on the opposite side of the football field didn't deflate by a large amount). The laws of physics have to work the same on both sides of a football field (and thus the argument by Pats fans that Brady didn't cheat has been proven false). Similarly, the rules of time travel have to work the same for someone in 2023 as they work for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond. So if Banner claims that they can't change the past, then Banner is also saying that they can't change the present or the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond.So EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has the free will to choose a different path. Like I said, I didn't make that up. That's how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about that, take that up with the Endgame writers.
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Post by poutinep on Jun 27, 2019 17:46:20 GMT
That's actually a good point. That's why the writing in Endgame is really bad and makes no sense at all. Because everything is inconsistent. Basically, the Endgame writers and MCU fans are trying to apply 2 separate rules (similar to how Pats fans tried to argue that weather caused the footballs that Brady used to cheat to deflate by arguing that the laws of physics work differently on opposite sides of a football field and thus caused the Pats footballs to deflate by a large amount while the Colts footballs on the opposite side of the football field didn't deflate by a large amount). The laws of physics have to work the same on both sides of a football field (and thus the argument by Pats fans that Brady didn't cheat has been proven false). Similarly, the rules of time travel have to work the same for someone in 2023 as they work for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond. So if Banner claims that they can't change the past, then Banner is also saying that they can't change the present or the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond.So EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has the free will to choose a different path. Like I said, I didn't make that up. That's how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about that, take that up with the Endgame writers.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jun 27, 2019 18:27:05 GMT
Basically saying your past doesn't get rewritten on you. It still happened. 1st, saying "your past becomes your future" is stupid and makes no sense at all. The past and future are opposite directions so No, the past doesn't become the future. 2nd, like I said, if we go by what Banner claims, that you can't change the past, then the same rule has to also apply to the present and the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 and 2033 and beyond. Basically, the Endgame writers and MCU fans are trying to apply 2 separate rules (similar to how Pats fans tried to argue that weather caused the footballs that Brady used to cheat to deflate by arguing that the laws of physics work differently on opposite sides of a football field and thus caused the Pats footballs to deflate by a large amount while the Colts footballs on the opposite side of the football field didn't deflate by a large amount). The laws of physics have to work the same on both sides of a football field (and thus the argument by Pats fans that Brady didn't cheat has been proven false). Similarly, the rules of time travel have to work the same for someone in 2023 as they work for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond. So if Banner claims that they can't change the past, then Banner is also saying that they can't change the present or the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond.So EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has the free will to choose a different path. Like I said, I didn't make that up. That's how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about that, take that up with the Endgame writers. So the phrase "back to the future" makes total sense to you? You can't go back to the future because it is ahead of you.
He's not saying you can't change the past. He's saying you can't change your past. Take, for instance, Back to the Future. George was about to walk away from Loraine as a coward. Doing this caused Marty to start disappearing because he wouldn't have been born. What they are saying in Endgame is that Marty was already born in another timeline so he shouldn't have started disappearing. That's why Nebula can kill her younger self. Back to the Future's rule is that whatever you do in the past overrides the future because it's all one timeline. Back to the Future doesn't have a multiverse. Which makes the DCU even more messed up.
The DCU has 52 Earths caused by branching timelines, but... Those Earths override each other when you mess with time in the past. Example: When Barry created Flashpoint, that overrode his current timeline. It didn't mess with any of the other Earths.
Another example of how the MCU time travel works is Black Widow. If they go back in time to save her, they'd have to bring her back with them like Gamora. If they stop her from jumping off the cliff, she wouldn't be there waiting on them because that would cause a new timeline. That's why Steve doesn't change events to make the world better. If he did then it wouldn't play out like it did before. If he changed anything then the events of the MCU wouldn't happen and he probably wouldn't go back in time to marry Peggy. And he knew he goes back to marry Peggy because of his photo on her desk.
So here are the facts. You can go back in time, but you can only go back to the future (your past) that you are anchored to. If you change anything in the past, you can't go to that future. There is no forward time travel using the quantum realm because it hasn't happened yet. Or they haven't figured it out yet.
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Post by ShrunkenHeadonKnightBus on Jun 27, 2019 18:34:55 GMT
( reads through six pages of explaining time travel)
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 27, 2019 18:41:38 GMT
1st, saying "your past becomes your future" is stupid and makes no sense at all. The past and future are opposite directions so No, the past doesn't become the future. 2nd, like I said, if we go by what Banner claims, that you can't change the past, then the same rule has to also apply to the present and the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 and 2033 and beyond. Basically, the Endgame writers and MCU fans are trying to apply 2 separate rules (similar to how Pats fans tried to argue that weather caused the footballs that Brady used to cheat to deflate by arguing that the laws of physics work differently on opposite sides of a football field and thus caused the Pats footballs to deflate by a large amount while the Colts footballs on the opposite side of the football field didn't deflate by a large amount). The laws of physics have to work the same on both sides of a football field (and thus the argument by Pats fans that Brady didn't cheat has been proven false). Similarly, the rules of time travel have to work the same for someone in 2023 as they work for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond. So if Banner claims that they can't change the past, then Banner is also saying that they can't change the present or the future because the present and future for someone in 2023 is already the past for someone in 2028 or 2033 or beyond.So EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has the free will to choose a different path. Like I said, I didn't make that up. That's how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about that, take that up with the Endgame writers. So the phrase "back to the future" makes total sense to you? You can't go back to the future because it is ahead of you.
It makes perfect sense in the context that "back" is being used. In that sentence, going "back" means returning to where you originally were. It's similar to if I fly from the California to New York and then I say "I'm flying BACK West this weekend." BACK doesn't mean that West becomes East or East and West switch directions. BACK simply means returning to where I originally was - California. Similarly, BACK to the Future simply means Marty returning back to where he originally started - 1985.
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Post by Skaathar on Jun 27, 2019 19:04:07 GMT
Of course you made it up. If it was true you'd have easily quoted what Banner said about predetermined futures by now. So go on then little troll, please quote exactly where Banner said their futures were predetermined. No, I didn't make anything up. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers. If you didn't make anything up then go ahead and quote exactly what Banner said where he supposedly claimed that futures were predetermined. Don't try to make an explanation about past, present and future, you'll just make your head hurt talking about stuff you don't understand. So I'm making it easy for you, troll. Just quote what Banner said.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jun 27, 2019 19:32:44 GMT
So the phrase "back to the future" makes total sense to you? You can't go back to the future because it is ahead of you.
It makes perfect sense in the context that "back" is being used. In that sentence, going "back" means returning to where you originally were. It's similar to if I fly from the California to New York and then I say "I'm flying BACK West this weekend." BACK doesn't mean that West becomes East or East and West switch directions. BACK simply means returning to where I originally was - California. Similarly, BACK to the Future simply means Marty returning back to where he originally started - 1985. Exactly. Back to where you were. Were is used when talking about the past, correct? Just because where you was is the future doesn't mean it is not your past.
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Post by Lord Death Man on Jun 27, 2019 19:36:13 GMT
Holy trolling travesty, Batman! Can I change my answer to the question?One where there is no DC-Fan.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 27, 2019 23:46:04 GMT
It's amusing that DC-Fraud has to try and concoct a convoluted and unconvincing explanation why the future in the MCU is predetermined ... after he already presented a simple and straightforward reason why the DCEU future is predetermined.
Just wind him up, and watch him shred himself to pieces. LOL!
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 28, 2019 2:03:35 GMT
No, I didn't make anything up. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers. If you didn't make anything up then go ahead and quote exactly what Banner said where he supposedly claimed that futures were predetermined. Banner confirmed it in Endgame when he said they can't change the past. And since the 2023 is the past to someone in 2028 or 2033 or any time in the future, that automatically means they also can't change the present or the future. So according to Banner (and the Endgame writers) EVERYTHING in MCU is already pre-determined and set in stone and no one has any free will to change their path. Like I said, don't blame me for this. This is how the Endgame writers wrote it. So if you have a complaint about this, then go take it up with the Endgame writers.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 28, 2019 2:06:44 GMT
It makes perfect sense in the context that "back" is being used. In that sentence, going "back" means returning to where you originally were. It's similar to if I fly from the California to New York and then I say "I'm flying BACK West this weekend." BACK doesn't mean that West becomes East or East and West switch directions. BACK simply means returning to where I originally was - California. Similarly, BACK to the Future simply means Marty returning back to where he originally started - 1985. Exactly. Back to where you were. Were is used when talking about the past, correct? Just because where you was is the future doesn't mean it is not your past. The BACK in that context isn't referring to a time period. The BACK in that context is simply referring to a starting point. Like when I say "I'm flying BACK West this weekend" or even "I'm flying BACK home this weekend", that's not referring to any time period. That's simply referring to a starting point.
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Post by damngumby on Jun 28, 2019 9:58:38 GMT
If you didn't make anything up then go ahead and quote exactly what Banner said where he supposedly claimed that futures were predetermined. I can't.
So I'm just going to repeat myself until I become enough of an irritant that a mod steps in and locks this thread. I think we're done here.
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